Apollo's Chariot

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Would have been built with parts going out of production/already out of production and newer systems could be more efficient. Just two examples from the top of my head. My company's main business is taking control systems from the 80s and 90s and bringing them up to modern technology. Also, electrical parts break over time too. A lot of time, customers want new features that we can integrate now that were not available back then. Think about why you would get a new laptop or cell phone after buying one years prior. Same basic reasons apply.
 
While in general that makes sense, I'd think that roller coaster controls are built with a singular overall purpose (safely transport guests on the ride) and not like consumer electronics that fluctuate based on market demands. Yes, I know that not all parts of the controls systems deal with transporting guests, but I'm thinking of what the overall purpose of the ride is.

Therefore, that begs the question of if any irreplaceable parts wore out to where the only way new parts would work is with a new controls system?

And more to the point - what kind of parts would AC have that couldn't be replaced? I'm pretty sure if it's old DOS based computer systems that there's a way to rebuild those cheaply and easily.


But, I'm also ok with modernizing - if it makes TM jobs easier, increases capacity, and continues ensuring safety without reducing guest expectations, then why not. It's great to see a park continue to put an investment in what's becoming an older ride, especially with their brand new ride approximately next door.
 
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Jonesta6 said:
While in general that makes sense, I'd think that roller coaster controls are built with a singular overall purpose (safely transport guests on the ride) and not like consumer electronics that fluctuate based on market demands. Yes, I know that not all parts of the controls systems deal with transporting guests, but I'm thinking of what the overall purpose of the ride is.

Therefore, that begs the question of if any irreplaceable parts wore out to where the only way new parts would work is with a new controls system?

And more to the point - what kind of parts would AC have that couldn't be replaced? I'm pretty sure if it's old DOS based computer systems that there's a way to rebuild those cheaply and easily.


But, I'm also ok with modernizing - if it makes TM jobs easier, increases capacity, and continues ensuring safety without reducing guest expectations, then why not. It's great to see a park continue to put an investment in what's becoming an older ride, especially with their brand new ride approximately next door.
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To get specific, AC is built with Allen Bradley SLC500 controllers. These were great when they came out in the early 90s, but by the early 2000s, Allen Bradley came out with the Logix series controllers. There were (and still are) far superior in performance and user friendliness than the 500s. Biggest advantage is that it switches from memory based tags (ie you have a dedicated "address" in the memory that you have to use, it was in octal, not decimal numbers, so 10=8) to name based tags (ie you give each variable a name that you can easily remember). The ControLogix series (and its little sibling the CompactLogix) are just leaps and bounds ahead of the 500 series. After almost 20 years, this line is fantastic (the most common PLC on the market today). This to say that Allen bradley is phasing out the SLC500 line to get everyone on the Logix line. Hence the reason my company has so much business. If a part of that system breaks, you don't necessarily want to have only ebay to turn to in order to get your ride running again. It is certainly possible that BGW is phasing out all of the SLC (or the even older PLC5 series) run rides with contrologix. CP has been doing that over the past few years, using at least Consign and IOE, maybe others too. As to the point about my comparison to consumer devices, it is true that they don't fluctuate with the market like cell phones do. They run a lot longer than consumer electronics, but at the end of the day, they still wear out, just much slower. 20 years of use wears any computer, so it's not unreasonable to upgrade it.
 
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ControlsEE said:
To get specific, AC is built with Allen Bradley SLC500 controllers. These were great when they came out in the early 90s, but by the early 2000s, Allen Bradley came out with the Logix series controllers. There were (and still are) far superior in performance and user friendliness than the 500s. Biggest advantage is that it switches from memory based tags (ie you have a dedicated "address" in the memory that you have to use, it was in octal, not decimal numbers, so 10=8) to name based tags (ie you give each variable a name that you can easily remember). The ControLogix series (and its little sibling the CompactLogix) are just leaps and bounds ahead of the 500 series. After almost 20 years, this line is fantastic (the most common PLC on the market today). This to say that Allen bradley is phasing out the SLC500 line to get everyone on the Logix line. Hence the reason my company has so much business. If a part of that system breaks, you don't necessarily want to have only ebay to turn to in order to get your ride running again. It is certainly possible that BGW is phasing out all of the SLC (or the even older PLC5 series) run rides with contrologix. CP has been doing that over the past few years, using at least Consign and IOE, maybe others too. As to the point about my comparison to consumer devices, it is true that they don't fluctuate with the market like cell phones do. They run a lot longer than consumer electronics, but at the end of the day, they still wear out, just much slower. 20 years of use wears any computer, so it's not unreasonable to upgrade it.
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That... Makes a lot of sense.

It sounds like the difference between using a domain address (quad octets) vs. a URL.

Seems kind of normal that planned (or possibly unplanned) obsolescence is at play here - curious if Allen Bradley systems are the only ones that can be used, or is this one of those things that to switch to a competitor would require a whole lot more time, effort, money, and possibly equipment than it's worth?
 
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Jonesta6 said:
That... Makes a lot of sense.

It sounds like the difference between using a domain address (quad octets) vs. a URL.

Seems kind of normal that planned (or possibly unplanned) obsolescence is at play here - curious if Allen Bradley systems are the only ones that can be used, or is this one of those things that to switch to a competitor would require a whole lot more time, effort, money, and possibly equipment than it's worth?
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If you are a networking guru, it would be like trying to use the internet without a DNS, using an excel spreadsheet with every website's IP address that ever existed. Not easy!

They are not the only manufacturer. AB is the king in America, but Siemens is the main PLC found in Europe. Busch uses both, usually getting whatever the manufacturer normally installs. I personally like AB's software way better, but I haven't used that much Siemens. AutomationDirect is an up and coming PLC manufacturer that focuses on the more budget conscious company (reducing a $5k allen bradley processor to a slightly simpler automationdirect model for less than $500. )
 
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ControlsEE said:
AutomationDirect is an up and coming PLC manufacturer that focuses on the more budget conscious company (reducing a $5k allen bradley processor to a slightly simpler automationdirect model for less than $500. )
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Backyard coaster builders, take note!

A more expensive but still achievable and authentic alternative to an old Raspberry Pi.
 
halfabee said:
Backyard coaster builders, take note!

A more expensive but still achievable and authentic alternative to an old Raspberry Pi.
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Exactly. Sure beats the 1756-L81S controller at almost $7k MSRP! I have already started coding a too be designed backyard coaster using the Productivity 2000 controller. Much easier to program for someone who doesn't know traditional programming languages, though they just came out with an Arduino based model for $50.
 
Screenshot_20200311-063559_Busch Gardens.jpg
Screenshot_20200311-063620_Busch Gardens.jpg

According to these two quick queue blocks, looks like the park might anticipate Apollo going up in 2 weeks. Not hard evidence of course.
 
You end up with a big line just to skip the line. The year I was at AC, we saw QQ lines upwards of 2 hours, even with having two rows (2 and 8) open. The regular line was about an hour and a half (filled most of the queue house) That was the year they first started letting us do QQ trains.
 
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Apollo might be the one ride I wouldnt use it on truthfully, but I never saw heavy QQ usage in the days I usually go..
 
I'm pretty sure @BGWnut and @FoozMuz were right...

bgwfans.com

Apollo's Chariot May Not Be Ready for Opening Day

As opening day approaches, bits and pieces of Busch Gardens Williamsburg’s website have been slowly receiving updates. Most of these changes have been pretty mundane, but, as one of ParkFans’ forum members, FoozMuz, pointed out this morning, there is a particularly suspicious recent change to...
bgwfans.com bgwfans.com
 
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