Attaching my below post here - Sorry for the double post:
“Also, asking someone “Why do you hate the handicap” after they said nothing that would suggest they hate the handicap, is wild as fuck.”
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Accessibility Accomodations Abuse
- Thread starter MrBradferd
- Start date
Attaching my below post here - Sorry for the double post:
“Also, asking someone “Why do you hate the handicap” after they said nothing that would suggest they hate the handicap, is wild as fuck.”
It was tongue in cheek. It's also northdetective. Fk em
How do you sugest this issue gets fixed for ADA?
I literally never said I was going to use it in the first place. I just made a “last resort” comment since I’m eligible but I doubt I’ll use it again esp after cedar point where I survived waiting 2 1/2 hrs for tt2.
While I don’t agree necessarily with “double dipping” most of the time, for me energy management is important so I’ve made the choice to do it in the past because it means that I’m that much closer to getting home with a heat pad and other pain relief.
Whether or not Mr. Bradford is the one who is actually disabled is irrelevant when he’s defending his disabled friend from a bunch of people on an Internet forum throwing gross generalizations and also doubt are medical professionals. Seems like a good quality to me.
Whether or not Mr. Bradford is the one who is actually disabled is irrelevant when he’s defending his disabled friend from a bunch of people on an Internet forum throwing gross generalizations and also doubt are medical professionals. Seems like a good quality to me.
This is to touchy of a subject to debate tbh. Im not doing this because theres no win for anyone. Nothing can be said on either side without looking like an ass.
Parks can either fix the "issue" whichever it may be or not and people can use the system how it's written in the rules.
Parks can either fix the "issue" whichever it may be or not and people can use the system how it's written in the rules.
@CoasterBroCam we're all adults 
nobody's gonna hold a grudge because something you said prompted discussion on a discussion board. the convo has moved on
"I break the rules when I feel it's necessary for me. Other people in my party also benefit from this practice. They should be able to simultaneously brag about the advantages of the ADA program and claim there are no advantages."
nobody's gonna hold a grudge because something you said prompted discussion on a discussion board. the convo has moved on"I break the rules when I feel it's necessary for me. Other people in my party also benefit from this practice. They should be able to simultaneously brag about the advantages of the ADA program and claim there are no advantages."
The double dipping option isn't really as viable as you make it out to be, unless it's someone faking a disability to get a pass. Most individuals who need accessibility passes have physical or mental disabilities that slow their movement around the park in general compared to non disabled guests. Sure someone on an accessibility pass can ride the carousel or get a bite to eat while waiting for TT, but they also usually can't speed across the park to TT when it opens or when the line is low. In general, the accessibility passes for disabled individuals net out pretty close to what an average guest is experiencing in terms of total rides and time.
Close! Let me rephrase from my experience.
“I’m in a shit ton of pain, and I have two choices. I can either wait 60 minutes THEN walk in a different direction from the exit after this and wait time for five minutes where they will just send me down the longer ADA path and wait a few cycles for me to be able to get on OR go to the ride immediately and wait the five minutes in line where I can immediately ride and then sit for the rest of my ADA wait. “
As I said before, this discussion is largely a bunch of bullies who assume everyone not in a wheelchair is faking without the experience of actually being disabled or medical education to make proper judgements. Fuck all of you.
I’ve long held that there’s an easy solution that would not make ADA users upset and deter anyone taking advantage:
ADA isn’t a pass to the front of the line, rather with an ADA pass when you get to the start of the queue you are given a ticket/pass/whatever, that based on the wait time, and the time it is, has a marking of when you can return to use the ADA entrance to the ride.
ADA isn’t a pass to the front of the line, rather with an ADA pass when you get to the start of the queue you are given a ticket/pass/whatever, that based on the wait time, and the time it is, has a marking of when you can return to use the ADA entrance to the ride.
From my experience working inside theme parks, it isn't just viable, it happens constantly. Many guests holding these passes explicitly leverage the virtual return window to marathon shorter standby lines across the park while their timer runs down. Some guests use the system strictly as intended, but plenty of bad actors take full advantage of that gap.
That simply doesn't align with operational reality. On any given day that isn't completely dead, ADA users who strategically double-dip end up getting significantly higher ride counts than guests in standard lines. Beyond that, operational realities at the ride platform often mean ADA users are dispatched much faster than the actual standby wait posted at the front entrance.
Which is why I have an issue with it, when the sole purpose of it is:
Also, necessary to point:
The post quoted above was edited after the fact to add that second sentence. Adding "How do you suggest this issue gets fixed for ADA?" after the fact doesn't soften the blow or make the initial snide remark any more appropriate.
@warfelg basically all of these programs do work like that in theory.
I think there can be a case-by-case, nuanced discussion to be had around the ethics of double-dipping with these programs. I wouldn't begrudge anyone who is primarily affected by the overall length of activity for using a disability access program to maximize efficiency and get in and out of the park ASAP. I would be dramatically more skeptical if someone used the loophole to go open to close, riding things over and over again, achieving more than any normal guest could ever reasonably do without disability access.
I have also seen a number of situations (a not insignificant number!) where disability passes will be given obviously super absurd come-back times when they're completely unjustified (I've seen BGW give RAP an hour+ when the line is obviously less than 20 minutes). When something like that happens, the park's awful administration of the program basically forces double dipping just to start to approach a level playing field.
That being said, I do believe there is also a lot of abuse happening on the guest side too. Unethical people have learned that, at many parks, you can just lie and claim a disability you don't have to get "free front of the line." Universal and Disney have created more robust vetting systems because of this abuse and I, unfortunately, think that in today's sadly low-trust society, every park needs to follow suit.
I tend to believe that people lying their way into these programs is a far more severe and a far more impactful problem than people who rightly are enrolled supposedly "misusing" the access by means of double-dipping and other potential loopholes. People who need these programs are the ones least likely to abuse them, in my estimation. I also believe the inverse is true—the most legitimate abuse of loopholes is almost certainly coming from the people who should not be in these programs in the first place.
I think there can be a case-by-case, nuanced discussion to be had around the ethics of double-dipping with these programs. I wouldn't begrudge anyone who is primarily affected by the overall length of activity for using a disability access program to maximize efficiency and get in and out of the park ASAP. I would be dramatically more skeptical if someone used the loophole to go open to close, riding things over and over again, achieving more than any normal guest could ever reasonably do without disability access.
I have also seen a number of situations (a not insignificant number!) where disability passes will be given obviously super absurd come-back times when they're completely unjustified (I've seen BGW give RAP an hour+ when the line is obviously less than 20 minutes). When something like that happens, the park's awful administration of the program basically forces double dipping just to start to approach a level playing field.
That being said, I do believe there is also a lot of abuse happening on the guest side too. Unethical people have learned that, at many parks, you can just lie and claim a disability you don't have to get "free front of the line." Universal and Disney have created more robust vetting systems because of this abuse and I, unfortunately, think that in today's sadly low-trust society, every park needs to follow suit.
I tend to believe that people lying their way into these programs is a far more severe and a far more impactful problem than people who rightly are enrolled supposedly "misusing" the access by means of double-dipping and other potential loopholes. People who need these programs are the ones least likely to abuse them, in my estimation. I also believe the inverse is true—the most legitimate abuse of loopholes is almost certainly coming from the people who should not be in these programs in the first place.
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Close! I just don't go around weaponizing the cumulative years of my life that have been stolen by disability, and I don't use them to benefit from the system now that I've returned to being largely able-bodied, because I know that other people with more severe and current disabilities need the program more than I would. I would like for more people to exercise the considerations I make so people who actually cannot access the rides without the program can make use of it
The disability pass system is about as close to a textbook “honor system” as it gets. I don’t understand the feigned outrage when you seem to be openly advocating for exploiting an honor-based system just because you can.Yea im done with this lol if the system exists use it. Its the parks fault not mine they wrote it the way they did. Dont hate the player hate the game
On the front of this part, this is where (IMO) HIPPA laws themselves make is so tough to qualify. I do think a more robust system is necessary. But they need a better way of vetting and making the system so it's not a loophole to getting more ride time.
Only reason I dislike the 'misuse' of the access, double-dipping, and other loopholes is because of the first point of people lying their way into the programs. I wish I had data or something to back up my feelings, but I feel there would be a lot of overlap of people who game the system and lie their way into having a pass.
Antidotal here - but I was at SFGAmer this past weekend, and there was a big group of like 10 people going with someone with an ADA pass, then the person with the injury (Something ankle/leg area, they had a cast) didn't even ride, but everyone with them go on the ride. Rather annoying as someone that had waited in line for 45 minutes already.
I’m not being facetious when I say this, but I’m happy that you have been able to not have to use it anymore. I wish I could and I wish that I didn’t have to rely on them. As I said, I don’t like the idea of double dipping, but pain and desperation for relief are huge motivators and I won’t fault others for succumbing to them.
I think we can all agree regardless that those types of people are the scum of the earth. You’re not even allowed to use it if the person who needs it doesn’t ride.
Ok - maybe it's because it's Monday, maybe it's because I've never interacted with these programs myself, maybe it's due to my poor dinner choice from last night is still assaulting my digestive system, but I am struggling with associating the term "double dipping" to the appropriate context. All I can envision is George Costanza getting accused of basically putting his whole mouth in the dip at the wake party.
Do ADA passes basically give you a window where you can access a ride? And it's not one-and-done? So essentially, if a current wait time is 30 minutes, and I have a 30-minute window, and the ADA line is essentially 5 minutes, I could theoretically snag multiple times "fast pass"-style when I otherwise wouldn't be able to? Is that right? Didn't Mythbusters disprove the this on one of their shows and it actually isn't a danger to double dip the chip?
(That last sentence is obviously intended as a joke.)
Do ADA passes basically give you a window where you can access a ride? And it's not one-and-done? So essentially, if a current wait time is 30 minutes, and I have a 30-minute window, and the ADA line is essentially 5 minutes, I could theoretically snag multiple times "fast pass"-style when I otherwise wouldn't be able to? Is that right? Didn't Mythbusters disprove the this on one of their shows and it actually isn't a danger to double dip the chip?
(That last sentence is obviously intended as a joke.)
Well I guess our morals don't align then lol Fix the system if it's a problem. Ill tell anyone to abuse taxes and stuff to if it's within the law to do so. Lawyers and tax accountants ect all do loopholes. Sorry not sorry.