Volcano Goes Extinct

[mwhinva]

I remember riding the Haunted River on a day with moderate rain. The ride's inside scenes leaked rainwater in numerous, and I do mean numerous, places. Quite a lot of rainwater. It seemed to be beyond the park's capability to keep up with the scale of the issue. This was back in the 1980s and early 1990s. By now I can't even imagine how much patchwork-over-patchwork-over-patchwork remediation of various kinds has been visited upon that structure.

How long did the original crews designing and building the mountain expect it to remain in the park in the first place? If you had told them in the 1970s that their work would have multiple lives, adapting to new ride technologies and elevated public expectations, turning into a danged fire-spewing volcano in service of a totally unique, record-setting, space-age roller coaster ride, and then living to see the impossibly futuristic year 2019 -- don't you think they would have been absolutely thrilled? I do.

I really doubt the structure's anticipated service life back in the 1970s was something on the order of 40 years, and honestly I am a little bit surprised that the Intamin ride system built around it made it to 20. (I am similarly surprised by the Flight of Fear rides' continued existences, though that is a completely different story for some other time.) Kudos to the park for keeping Volcano's unique but odd combination of papier-mache scenery and quirky first-two-thirds-of-a-coaster upright and operational for so many years.

Keep in mind that Cedar Fair has a park with TWO structures that are similar in construction to Volcano's (steel I-beam infrastructure, rebar based outer form with mesh, and a 1-2 inch layer of sprayed concrete on top of it. And they are both older than KD's mountain.

Knotts has a mine train attraction and a log flume attraction that are dark rides or have major dark ride components to them. Both received major refurbs to the "fake rock" facades, and all new dark ride scenes for them.

I certainly don't know what will be replacing Volcano; but, the potential to extend the life of the mountain structure certainly exists within the CF chain. Matter of fact, this would give KD the best opportunity for a major refurb on the mountain structure without the coaster going in - through - around the outer shell.

Keep in mind that what the park has left is just the outer shell of what was "The Lost World" ride complex. The interior had multiple "caverns" and "tunnels" that made up the scene areas for the Haunted River flume and Doozy/Smurf mine train. Some of those "caverns" for the Haunted River scenes were massive, having ceilings of around 30 feet. Even the "Time Shaft" Rotor flat ride had a "rock tunnel" queue line and "cavern" for the ride itself.

KD certainly has the opportunity to make the structure back into a mountain, with or without another coaster attraction on that spot. Plus, with the mountain already gutted, the park has a blank canvas to work with whatever they come up with in the future.

It all comes down to whether the mountain stays or goes with the coaster.

 

[Nicole]

I want to contest @thopping’s premise that the mountain isn't linked to a larger themed area. Perhaps since you haven’t been there, you aren't aware that is has been the centerpiece of the surrounding section, since it was first built.

KD is not a theme park, so naturally, it won't be as immersive as Disney, but it is themed, and both Lost World and Volcano were integral parts of the area concepts.

 

[halfabee]

Keep in mind that Cedar Fair has a park with TWO structures that are similar in construction to Volcano's (steel I-beam infrastructure, rebar based outer form with mesh, and a 1-2 inch layer of sprayed concrete on top of it. And they are both older than KD's mountain

Out of curiosity -- what are the general conditions of those structures?

 

[WDWRLD]

This is my opinion only but I consider the mountain a huge part of the Congo section of KD.Its also one of the key parts of many signs around the park. The best comparison for me is Big Ben at BGW. If it were removed there would be some really ugly sight lines in that area.

 

[mwhinva]

Out of curiosity -- what are the general conditions of those structures?

I would assume very good since both attractions underwent refurbishment within the last 5-6 years. Timber mountain log flume in 2013. Calico Mine ride in 2014.

If you look at the video imbedded in the Calico Mine Ride article, you can get a little of what it was like to ride the Doozy/Smurf and Haunted River dark rides in the mountain at KD (Yeah, I know, not same theme, but gives a glimpse of what KD's non-VR dark rides were like back then). I am not sure of the log flume structure; but, the Calico Mine Train opened in 1960. So that would have made the Calico Mine Train attraction 19 years old when "The Lost World" opened at KD in 1979.

Knotts Timber Mountain 2013

Knotts Calico Mine Ride 2014

 

[halfabee]

Thanks. Just curious because I remember the condition of the KD mountain seeming LOLbad back in the late 80s, when it was only about 10 years old. (Prior post)

I'm pretty sure I rode everything that was in the mountain back then (not 100% sure about Kilimanjaro), and Time Shaft in particular was awesome. But Smurf Mountain and especially Haunted River were showcases for the mountain's rather fundamental looking warts. I wonder if the other similar structures currently in the CF portfolio were just built better in the first place.

 

[wombat96]

I just realized if they tear down the physical mountain the Flight of Fear show building will become very prominent in the sight lines of Safari Village. Being that the land is already going through an identity crisis, the removal of the structure is going to open up the land into even more thematic issues. Obviously this isn't a major concern for the park or chain as a whole as many areas struggle thematically to find their traits that differentiate them from other generic theme park areas. If the mountain is removed, that is essentially removing the main theme of the land as it's visible from all sections of Safari Village and peaks out above the trees in other areas of the park. It's a second distinguishable icon to the park and help signifies the theme of the land.

 

[warfelg]

This shouldn't be said but I'll say it anyways:

If they need to take the mountain down they might as well retheme the entire area.....may I suggest a racing/speed theme to the area?

 

[WDWRLD]

Not only that but the taller trees are set back a ways, I wonder how much extra sounds from the train tracks would be heard as well as things like seeing the powerlines. I know all small issues. Another things is the campground, how much sound did the mountain block from the park for the campers there. Here is my bet, the ride is removed as much as they easily can from the mountain up, holes are repaired and patched and the mountain is left as just a visusl element until.......Winterfest where it will be covered in thousands of shimmering lights covering the "mountain in a festive blanket of snow". This then gives them a small meet and greet area where the gift shop was and space for a new seasonal dining area where the covered queue area was just above the gift shop.

 

[thopping]

I want to contest @thopping’s premise that the mountain isn't linked to a larger themed area. Perhaps since you haven’t been there, you aren't aware that is has been the centerpiece of the surrounding section, since it was first built.

Valid point. I have been there, and mostly before the Volcano retheme even, and the site I quoted reminded me of the history and how it was a huge centerpiece of the area...

Not trying to split hairs, but in my mind the way it was used as a centerpiece was less integral to the surrounding land than say, the mountain in FrontierLand. My admittedly-biased outlook tends to view these topics in the context higher themed parks, which I frequent much more.

Strictly within the context of KD, then I would agree it was a centerpiece. However, though historically it may have played such a role relative to KD, part of my point is that I don't believe (and again, this just a gut, outsider view) that CedarFair necessarily views the mountain as integral to the land either, and whether to raze it is probably more function of demo/redevelopment costs than nostalgia or because it would force a massive land retheme, since KD just doesn't theme to that degree.

Plus, even though it was a centerpiece, it was a mountain that then turned into a volcanic mountain... Maybe a subtle change, but I view that as more of a creative reuse for an old facility that had been idle versus being a evolution of the central E-Ticket attraction of the themed land as originally conceived. Had the area been themed more heavily to the mountain, such an update could be have been extensive to the areas around the attraction...so KD's lack of extensive themeing ironically may have really given them the flexibility to build the coaster in the first place.

 

[bill s]

RE: Secrecy, by not being forthcoming of any details of the problems of the ride, it makes it seem like it could have been a safety problem. Maybe it is just the drive system but it failed spectacularly. There was a Youtube video of a track inspection, I think it was 2017. All they need to say is "it wouldn't go no more" or whatever.

There is a new Angelo Giles video where he repeats something I heard, maybe it was another of his videos, that they did try to get it to run last summer and it kept rolling back. He also talks about the ride getting rougher. If replacing the drive system, in what we in the repair industry call "replacing all of them as a set", would reboot the ride for another 20 years they would have done it in a flash. Or after 8 months to get the parts.

As to the mountain, it's not like they can just dynamite it. It would be cheaper to carefully remove the ride and supports down to the mountain surface than the whole thing. Since the coaster structure would then not be supporting a coaster, it could be used for supporting the mountain, extra props or rockwork, internal structures or tents. It would be a great place to put the North Pole. Or it could support parts of a smaller, less tall coaster.

 

[Icer]

It would be cheaper to carefully remove the ride and supports down to the mountain surface than the whole thing.

Now is this your opinion, or do you have evidence of this?

Because all knowledge I and a lot of other people have about construction engineering disagrees with this statement, as it is much more costly in general to delicately disassemble part of something in this condition, than it is to just tear it down with either demo or removal of supports.

 

[madmax]

As to the mountain, it's not like they can just dynamite it. It would be cheaper to carefully remove the ride and supports down to the mountain surface than the whole thing. Since the coaster structure would then not be supporting a coaster, it could be used for supporting the mountain, extra props or rockwork, internal structures or tents. It would be a great place to put the North Pole. Or it could support parts of a smaller, less tall coaster.

It would be cheaper and a lot easier to bulldoze the entire thing actually. The ride is extremely delicately built around/into the mountain and you would risk a lot of structural damage by trying to take out the ride individually.

 

[TerrainHuggr]

Ouch. This is painful, not just to lose a very unique coaster but that mountain… As quintessential a part of KD as the eiffel tower. I really doubt it will survive the demolition process, nor that it would be worth it for them to try. I remember Smurf Mountain, Haunted River, and Time Shaft pretty well considering how long ago it was. Volcano was undoubtedly a ground-breaking coaster upon opening. However it had operational issues from the get go and I wasn't even aware it has not been operating at all for some time. I believe they had to add that second launch years back just to get enough speed if I remember correctly. Would've loved to get a final ride on it. Very unfortunate news. RIP. Man I can't help but imagine if they did a re-do from the ground-up, with the advanced design capabilities, as well as the mountain built after the fact instead of the other way around. The potential would be crazy. Keeping the best of the design but improving the weaknesses of the rest.

 

[thopping]

...It would be cheaper to carefully remove the ride and supports down to the mountain surface than the whole thing. Since the coaster structure would then not be supporting a coaster, it could be used for supporting the mountain, extra props or rockwork, internal structures or tents...

Well, that's the thing. The mountain isn't supporting the coaster; the coaster is supported through the mountain. The mountain is not solid structure that could bear the weight of the coaster, so you're not removing it from the top "down to the mountain surface"--that coaster is supported by the earth (and footers poured down to previously undisturbed earth at that), and you're going to need to carefully go through/around/etc. the mountain to remove it--assuming you want to save the mountain.

Caveated that I honestly don't know exactly how the mountain or coaster was built, but I do have some construction/engineering perspective and have read a bit more than I expected I would about this over the past days. The mountain is likely long in its expected design life and reports are is no longer structurally fit for purpose, at least as a structure originally purposed for multiple dark rides. The coaster may not be in good shape either at this point, and regardless, you're not going to sell it. So you're looking at the limited aesthetic value of the mountain (from CedarFair's likely view, not those of you fond of this thing) that would be more costly to deal with than just demo'ing the whole site.

Which is what I'm practically certain they will do, at least me trying to look at this in an objective way with some admittedly generalized assumptions about the site.

 

[madmax]

Imagine if KD came out and said “oh yeah btw when we said we were removing the Volcano we meant we’re rebuilding the entire ride from scratch”

 

[halfabee]

I believe they had to add that second launch years back just to get enough speed if I remember correctly.

The launch right before entering the mountain? That was always part of the ride.

 

[WDWRLD]

Could that be part of the overall issue as well. Not only is the dynamic structure that is the ride is at a state of major needed repair but the static mountain is in risk of having a piece fail that could contact the the coaster car that they are worried about.

 

[Mushroom]

^This is probably a fair point. I assume the park didn't spend millions of dollars rebuilding basically the entire back half (read: the unseen portion) of the mountain if it didn't really need it.

On the other hand, since the park has already invested millions into the mountain, that could be a reason to justify keeping it. Shelling out those big bucks for—what, two years of use?—would be a tremendous waste of the park's finances. At least keeping the mountain would generate a better ROI.

 

[----------------------]

I think they realized they had a hole in the water, and they decided to stop throwing money into it.