Project 2022: Pantheon

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RE: Project Madrid: New Hamlet? Giga Coaster? 315' Tower?

Exactly; what I was trying to say. :) I'm not familiar with the FAA processes, but it seems like getting an extension is a relatively trivial administrative item.

All that being said, it seems like everything so far could support a 2019 opening--but they have latitude for 2020. Who knows...they could be planning for 2020 already and are expecting to extend their permit schedules out, they just want/need to start things now.
 
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RE: Project Madrid: New Hamlet? Giga Coaster? 315' Tower?

thopping said:
Exactly; what I was trying to say. :)   I'm not familiar with the FAA processes, but it seems like getting an extension is a relatively trivial administrative item.

All that being said, it seems like everything so far could support a 2019 opening--but they have latitude for 2020.  Who knows...they could be planning for 2020 already and are expecting to extend their permit schedules out, they just want/need to start things now.
Click to expand...

Basically all they have to do with the timeline is break ground by 3/2019. The JCC Height waiver gives them until 8/2020 to break ground, and the FAA waiver gives them until 3/19. So one is for 36 months, the other is for 72 months.

At this rate, I would think around 10/2018-11/2018 we see tree removal, 1/2020-2/2020 footers and vertical construction start.
 
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RE: Project Madrid: New Hamlet? Giga Coaster? 315' Tower?

I also saw the FAA did us no favors in getting a heads-up that construction is starting:

It is required that FAA Form 7460-2, Notice of Actual Construction or Alteration, be e-filed any time the
project is abandoned or:
_____ At least 10 days prior to start of construction (7460-2, Part 1)
__X__ Within 5 days after the construction reaches its greatest height (7460-2, Part 2)
Click to expand...

By the time they're w/in 5 days of the attraction's highest point we'll all know already...even with the "Nothing to see here" fences. :)
 
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RE: Project Madrid: New Hamlet? Giga Coaster? 315' Tower?

warfelg said:
thopping said:
Exactly; what I was trying to say. :)   I'm not familiar with the FAA processes, but it seems like getting an extension is a relatively trivial administrative item.

All that being said, it seems like everything so far could support a 2019 opening--but they have latitude for 2020.  Who knows...they could be planning for 2020 already and are expecting to extend their permit schedules out, they just want/need to start things now.
Click to expand...

Basically all they have to do with the timeline is break ground by 3/2019. The JCC Height waiver gives them until 8/2020 to break ground, and the FAA waiver gives them until 3/19. So one is for 36 months, the other is for 72 months.

At this rate, I would think around 10/2018-11/2018 we see tree removal, 1/2020-2/2020 footers and vertical construction start.
Click to expand...

But when in true reality has busch started construction in spring? Busch usually breaks ground later in the season, not at the beginning.
 
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RE: Project Madrid: New Hamlet? Giga Coaster? 315' Tower?

MadridBot said:
warfelg said:
Basically all they have to do with the timeline is break ground by 3/2019. The JCC Height waiver gives them until 8/2020 to break ground, and the FAA waiver gives them until 3/19. So one is for 36 months, the other is for 72 months.

At this rate, I would think around 10/2018-11/2018 we see tree removal, 1/2020-2/2020 footers and vertical construction start.
Click to expand...

But when in true reality has busch started construction in spring? Busch usually breaks ground later in the season, not at the beginning.
Click to expand...

I don't really get what you're saying here.

Just because the waiver is good until a certain time doesn't mean you have to wait until it's about to expire to start construction.

If I had to put forth my best guess for the timeline from here (this is what I did before leaving planning department in local government)
~11/2017 the Notice of Intent for an EIS (Environmental Impact Statement) is filed, this is where the public can become involved, learn about the scope of the work, and alternatives that would be less impactful the work is.
~4/2018 Notice of Intent wraps up and a draft of the EIS is published for public review, has to stay up for 45 days.
~6/2018 Final EIS is published, where again it has to wait at least 30 days before it can become finalized.
~7/2018 Any field pens that need to be moved are moved, clean up of ground level growth
~8/2018 Utilities marked/Trees for removal marked
~10/2018 Trees start coming down, open field foundations start being dug.
~11/2018 Foundations start to get poured
All of 2019 construction happens
 
RE: Project Madrid: New Hamlet? Giga Coaster? 315' Tower?

So were looking at a 2020 Opening Date Most Likely? That would be a great 45th anniversary gift.
 
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RE: Project Madrid: New Hamlet? Giga Coaster? 315' Tower?

2muchpopcorn said:
So were looking at a 2020 Opening Date Most Likely? That would be a great 45th anniversary gift.
Click to expand...

Just to be clear, I have no sources for that, I’m just going off of timelines for projects I’ve worked on.

It is possible that they’ve been doing the EPA EIS all along and they can start clearing brush in the winter and start pouring footers in the spring. But just kinda logically thinking here, why do the EIS if you aren’t sure you will be granted the height waiver. And I would think they would want to put some space between 2 major instillations. Opening a new coaster with only one year gap after Invadr is really close. Going 2020 makes sense as there is time and it’s the 45th.

Logically if this is a coaster:
2017 - Invadr
2018 - VR experience
2019 - lay low and refurbish some rides
2020 - new coaster
 
RE: Project Madrid: New Hamlet? Giga Coaster? 315' Tower?

Keep in mind definitions vary. Starting construction in one context means may mean that you've pulled a building permit. In another, broken ground to include site prep work. It doesn't mean necessarily that structure erection is starting, though the public may think that as it's very visible.

I have no idea if this is 2019 or 2020. One can make a logical argument that either is what they're planning on. My point is everything we've seen so far demonstrates they have flexibility to support either, and with so many variables to include weather and resource protection provisions, they made need it. Although they know how long to expect and I'm sure are executing to a detailed plan.
 
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RE: Project Madrid: New Hamlet? Giga Coaster? 315' Tower?

Start of construction on all permits typically refers to breaking ground.
 
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RE: Project Madrid: New Hamlet? Giga Coaster? 315' Tower?

Yep. And I think commencement in the context of the height waiver approval means they've simply pulled the permits. And the FAA language is covered above. YMMV. :)
 
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RE: Project Madrid: New Hamlet? Giga Coaster? 315' Tower?

I had mentioned awhile back that 2019 is B&M's (technical) 30th year in operation. It would be nice for them to commemorate it at BGW in a big, tall, creative way. ;-D

BGT deserves something for big boys and girls soon too.
 
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RE: Project Madrid: New Hamlet? Giga Coaster? 315' Tower?

Bring Back Questor 87 said:
I had mentioned awhile back that 2019 is B&M's (technical) 30th year in operation. It would be nice for them to commemorate it at BGW in a big, tall, creative way. ;-D

BGT deserves something for big boys and girls soon too.
Click to expand...

Both Busch Parks need a long thrilling ride imo.
 
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RE: Project Madrid: New Hamlet? Giga Coaster? 315' Tower?

2muchpopcorn said:
Bring Back Questor 87 said:
I had mentioned awhile back that 2019 is B&M's (technical) 30th year in operation. It would be nice for them to commemorate it at BGW in a big, tall, creative way. ;-D

BGT deserves something for big boys and girls soon too.
Click to expand...

Both Busch Parks need a long thrilling ride imo.
Click to expand...

Everyone needs a long thrilling ride every once in a while.
 
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RE: Project Madrid: New Hamlet? Giga Coaster? 315' Tower?

So... what do you think it is? B&M giga?
 
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RE: Project Madrid: New Hamlet? Giga Coaster? 315' Tower?

madmax said:
So... what do you think it is? B&M giga?
Click to expand...

Whatever it is, I hope it's big, long and fulfills my need... The need for speed. Like I305... And I PRAY B&M does'nt build it.

I've been in this community for almost 20 years now and their layouts are getting a little too predictable for me to be honest. I want someone who isn't Intamin to pull an Intamin. I305ish with a couple of inversions sounds like the move.
 
RE: Project Madrid: New Hamlet? Giga Coaster? 315' Tower?

Just some fun news. Lumberhack will be using bittens old entrance! Vampire point has been expanded to cover rhinefield, all the way to frostbite. We can now get good views of the station with lumberhack’s entrance being moved.
 
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RE: Project Madrid: New Hamlet? Giga Coaster? 315' Tower?

warfelg said:
If I had to put forth my best guess for the timeline from here (this is what I did before leaving planning department in local government)
~11/2017 the Notice of Intent for an EIS (Environmental Impact Statement) is filed, this is where the public can become involved, learn about the scope of the work, and alternatives that would be less impactful the work is.
~4/2018 Notice of Intent wraps up and a draft of the EIS is published for public review, has to stay up for 45 days.
~6/2018 Final EIS is published, where again it has to wait at least 30 days before it can become finalized.
~7/2018 Any field pens that need to be moved are moved, clean up of ground level growth
~8/2018 Utilities marked/Trees for removal marked
~10/2018 Trees start coming down, open field foundations start being dug.
~11/2018 Foundations start to get poured
All of 2019 construction happens
Click to expand...

Aren't EIS's done only for publicly owned projects (i.e. roadway projects)?  From what I have seen in the past with Busch projects and other private land development projects are height waivers, site plans, and special use permits (if the land use doesn't match the zoning).  After doing some digging a while ago, I found the submittal dates for past major projects at Busch:

 
RE: Project Madrid: New Hamlet? Giga Coaster? 315' Tower?

warfelg said:
If I had to put forth my best guess for the timeline from here (this is what I did before leaving planning department in local government)
~11/2017 the Notice of Intent for an EIS (Environmental Impact Statement) is filed, this is where the public can become involved, learn about the scope of the work, and alternatives that would be less impactful the work is.
~4/2018 Notice of Intent wraps up and a draft of the EIS is published for public review, has to stay up for 45 days.
~6/2018 Final EIS is published, where again it has to wait at least 30 days before it can become finalized.
~7/2018 Any field pens that need to be moved are moved, clean up of ground level growth
~8/2018 Utilities marked/Trees for removal marked
~10/2018 Trees start coming down, open field foundations start being dug.
~11/2018 Foundations start to get poured
All of 2019 construction happens
Click to expand...

Aren't EIS's done only for publicly owned projects (i.e. roadway projects)?  From what I have seen in the past with Busch projects and other private land development projects are height waivers, site plans, and special use permits (if the land use doesn't match the zoning).  After doing some digging a while ago, I found the submittal dates for past major projects at Busch:

  • Apollo's Chariot - Height Waiver submitted 10/7/1997, Height Waiver approved 12/9/1997, Site Plan submitted 3/20/1998, Opened 3/30/1999. Height Waiver Approval (pg. 5)
  • Griffon - Height Waiver submitted 1/23/2006, Height Waiver approved 4/11/2006, Site Plan submitted 4/19/2006, Opened 5/18/2007. Special Use Permit for Expansion Approval (pg. 127)
  • Mach Tower - Height Waiver submitted ??/??/2010, Height Waiver approved 6/8/2010, Site Plan submitted 7/20/2010, Opened 8/18/2011. Height Waiver Approval (pg. 55)
  • Verbolten - Height Waiver submitted 11/24/2010, Height Waiver approved 2/8/2011, Site Plan submitted 2/10/2011, Chesapeake Bay Board meeting 3/9/11 (for RPA buffer impacts), Opened 5/18/2012. Height Waiver/Special Use Permit Approval (pg. 43)
  • Tempesto - Height Waiver submitted 10/7/2013, Height Waiver Approved 11/12/2013, Initial utility markings requested 2/20/2014, Site Plan submitted 4/21/2014, Opened 4/25/2015. Height Waiver Approval (pg. 73)
  • Project Madrid - Height Waiver submitted 6/29/2017, Initial utility markings requested (assumed to be for this project) 7/19/2017, Height Waiver approved 8/8/2017. Height Waiver Approval (pg. 67)
 
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