RE: Project Madrid: New Hamlet? Giga Coaster? 315' Tower?
Stormrunner is a nice accelerator, but it's has A LOT of downtime.
Stormrunner is a nice accelerator, but it's has A LOT of downtime.
Project 2022: Pantheon
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RE: Project Madrid: New Hamlet? Giga Coaster? 315' Tower?
Stormrunner is pretty badass. I don't have objections to BG going for something in that style.
About the leaks: I can't tell if they're real or not - I'm not an expert. I kind of hope they're forgeries only because the person who posted the pics has a kid (kid gates in the background) and has a Nintendo Switch (e.g., expensive video game habit) and I'd hate to see him/her get fired with those kinds of commitments looming.
Stormrunner is pretty badass. I don't have objections to BG going for something in that style.
About the leaks: I can't tell if they're real or not - I'm not an expert. I kind of hope they're forgeries only because the person who posted the pics has a kid (kid gates in the background) and has a Nintendo Switch (e.g., expensive video game habit) and I'd hate to see him/her get fired with those kinds of commitments looming.
RE: Project Madrid: New Hamlet? Giga Coaster? 315' Tower?
+1 on Stormrunner. An accelerator that circuited over the Rhine (maybe inverting over the Rhine) would be nice. Stormrunner is infinintly better than a simple up and down tophat like TTD, IMHO, and TTD is down a lot. Recently at CP and it was down more than it was up it seemed.
I still prefer a B&M though. A B&M coaster circuiting and inverting over the Rhine would blow away any Intamin. A wing over the Rhine would be especially cool. I'd even take that over a giga, as I don't know B&M has built any wings approaching that height. Could they be combined? Think a giga Gatekeeper-like wing over the Rhine. That would be interesting...
As for the diagrams--I never saw them, like a few others. It sounds like there's a good chance they are fake though. I'm actually more curious in seeing them to try to debunk their authenticity than believing they're real and wanting to see a "leaked" document before Zachary et. al. follow the proper protocol with updates...
UncleDuncan said:
+1 on Stormrunner. An accelerator that circuited over the Rhine (maybe inverting over the Rhine) would be nice. Stormrunner is infinintly better than a simple up and down tophat like TTD, IMHO, and TTD is down a lot. Recently at CP and it was down more than it was up it seemed.
I still prefer a B&M though. A B&M coaster circuiting and inverting over the Rhine would blow away any Intamin. A wing over the Rhine would be especially cool. I'd even take that over a giga, as I don't know B&M has built any wings approaching that height. Could they be combined? Think a giga Gatekeeper-like wing over the Rhine. That would be interesting...
As for the diagrams--I never saw them, like a few others. It sounds like there's a good chance they are fake though. I'm actually more curious in seeing them to try to debunk their authenticity than believing they're real and wanting to see a "leaked" document before Zachary et. al. follow the proper protocol with updates...
RE: Project Madrid: New Hamlet? Giga Coaster? 315' Tower?
If it's an accelerator that does something like Storm Runner, I'd be totally down. A layout like TTD or Kingda Ka would be a total waste of space.
If it's an accelerator that does something like Storm Runner, I'd be totally down. A layout like TTD or Kingda Ka would be a total waste of space.
RE: Project Madrid: New Hamlet? Giga Coaster? 315' Tower?
If the ride starts at FP and crosses the Rhine into a tophat it might be a double launch. I know I would love a sit down with a corkscrew or a heartline roll. With Drachenfire gone I feel we are missing that.
There are a lot of new coaster styles out there BG could go with but at this height and this amount of money I doubt they would consider anybody but Intamin or B&M. If they go B&M there will be pressure to be better than Fury because of the only 5 hour distance. A better coaster than Fury would be a tall and expensive order. I305 is right up the road you don't want a clone of that or anything similar. I doubt there's room in this area for either of those type or rides. The tophat idea makes a lot of sense. The only other thing I could see being that tall would be a B&M wing.
If the ride starts at FP and crosses the Rhine into a tophat it might be a double launch. I know I would love a sit down with a corkscrew or a heartline roll. With Drachenfire gone I feel we are missing that.
There are a lot of new coaster styles out there BG could go with but at this height and this amount of money I doubt they would consider anybody but Intamin or B&M. If they go B&M there will be pressure to be better than Fury because of the only 5 hour distance. A better coaster than Fury would be a tall and expensive order. I305 is right up the road you don't want a clone of that or anything similar. I doubt there's room in this area for either of those type or rides. The tophat idea makes a lot of sense. The only other thing I could see being that tall would be a B&M wing.
RE: Project Madrid: New Hamlet? Giga Coaster? 315' Tower?
I would agree with it having a good chance of double launching if it's got the top hat on the other side. If it is could end up with something like Full Throtle at SFMM or Maverick....both "underwhelming" IMO. But then that puts it as an LIM launch as opposed to an accelerator like the rumor says.
Cthru3 said:
I would agree with it having a good chance of double launching if it's got the top hat on the other side. If it is could end up with something like Full Throtle at SFMM or Maverick....both "underwhelming" IMO. But then that puts it as an LIM launch as opposed to an accelerator like the rumor says.
RE: Project Madrid: New Hamlet? Giga Coaster? 315' Tower?
For it to be this tall and over 100 MPH I can't think of any accelerator near a minute long. There's also the red and yellow color scheme issue if you buy into the rumor at all. I do think part of it would make sense, the other half may be wrong or misinterpreted information or maybe even speculation or fantasy presented as fact. A rumor is still a rumor he may be 100% off but I'm fairly confident this will be a coaster.
For it to be this tall and over 100 MPH I can't think of any accelerator near a minute long. There's also the red and yellow color scheme issue if you buy into the rumor at all. I do think part of it would make sense, the other half may be wrong or misinterpreted information or maybe even speculation or fantasy presented as fact. A rumor is still a rumor he may be 100% off but I'm fairly confident this will be a coaster.
RE: Project Madrid: New Hamlet? Giga Coaster? 315' Tower?
Accelerator is Intamin's model name for their "Top Hat Style" tower launch coasters, not the type of launching mechanism. Intamin no longer uses hydraulic launches and their latest Accelerator at Port Adventura uses LSM. They are able to achieve the same (or greater) speeds with LSM (not LIM) and provide a safer and theoretically more efficient launch with theoretically less maintenance. The lines between the Accelerator/Blitz/iSpeed models of coasters manufactured by Intamin have become blurred in recent years.
warfelg said:
Accelerator is Intamin's model name for their "Top Hat Style" tower launch coasters, not the type of launching mechanism. Intamin no longer uses hydraulic launches and their latest Accelerator at Port Adventura uses LSM. They are able to achieve the same (or greater) speeds with LSM (not LIM) and provide a safer and theoretically more efficient launch with theoretically less maintenance. The lines between the Accelerator/Blitz/iSpeed models of coasters manufactured by Intamin have become blurred in recent years.
RE: Project Madrid: New Hamlet? Giga Coaster? 315' Tower?
This may not mean anything for "Project Madrid", but for the last two days the construction entrance gates for BG has been open. Today I saw a guy with a HiViz vest on standing just inside. They are almost never open while a project is not going on. Maybe someone knows what is going on?
This may not mean anything for "Project Madrid", but for the last two days the construction entrance gates for BG has been open. Today I saw a guy with a HiViz vest on standing just inside. They are almost never open while a project is not going on. Maybe someone knows what is going on?
RE: Project Madrid: New Hamlet? Giga Coaster? 315' Tower?
LIMs: Linear Induction Motors - Think of these as electromagnets laid out along a long path rather than in a circle. This is a gross oversimplification but it is important to understand that there are two electromagnets along the track and a fin on the train in between. The track changes magnets are in opposition and thus float the fin and propel it. FoF works on this complex principal.
LSMs: Linear Synchronous Motors - A bit less complex. There is a rare earth magnet on the train and electromagnets on the track. The electromagnets change polarity and attract to pull the train and then change to push it away.
Here is a good link.
I should say that there are some very cool AC things going on in both cases that sparkies like me nerd out on...
Maybe something to do with HOS?
LIMs: Linear Induction Motors - Think of these as electromagnets laid out along a long path rather than in a circle. This is a gross oversimplification but it is important to understand that there are two electromagnets along the track and a fin on the train in between. The track changes magnets are in opposition and thus float the fin and propel it. FoF works on this complex principal.
LSMs: Linear Synchronous Motors - A bit less complex. There is a rare earth magnet on the train and electromagnets on the track. The electromagnets change polarity and attract to pull the train and then change to push it away.
Here is a good link.
I should say that there are some very cool AC things going on in both cases that sparkies like me nerd out on...
Cthru3 said:
Maybe something to do with HOS?
RE: Project Madrid: New Hamlet? Giga Coaster? 315' Tower?
I actually view LSMs as much more complex due to the synchronization required to energize the magnetic fields with the right timing to propel the train down the track, versus LIMs that just energize the magnetic fields for the entire track at once and cycle the current frequency.
A good explanation of the two technologies in a coaster context is at: http://coasterforce.com/forums/threads/lim-vs-lsm.36578/ (Scroll down to Hixee/moderator's message). The wiki link, plus the wiki links on LIMs and LSMs themselves, are good, but potentially written in a way that the differences for a coaster may be lost--the coasterforce overview has just enough detail that a non-technical audience can probably understand it and yet not lose sight of explaining what the bottom lines are for coasters.
Zimmy said:
I actually view LSMs as much more complex due to the synchronization required to energize the magnetic fields with the right timing to propel the train down the track, versus LIMs that just energize the magnetic fields for the entire track at once and cycle the current frequency.
A good explanation of the two technologies in a coaster context is at: http://coasterforce.com/forums/threads/lim-vs-lsm.36578/ (Scroll down to Hixee/moderator's message). The wiki link, plus the wiki links on LIMs and LSMs themselves, are good, but potentially written in a way that the differences for a coaster may be lost--the coasterforce overview has just enough detail that a non-technical audience can probably understand it and yet not lose sight of explaining what the bottom lines are for coasters.
RE: Project Madrid: New Hamlet? Giga Coaster? 315' Tower?
Let me be clear, neither is simple. I meant simpler in terms of concept not execution.
Let me be clear, neither is simple. I meant simpler in terms of concept not execution.
RE: Project Madrid: New Hamlet? Giga Coaster? 315' Tower?
I'd like to iterate my thoughts as nicely and as quickly as I can:
Tophats...
Intamin...
Launches...
^Likely not happening in 2019. They have 2 launched coasters, and nothing Intamin can do will set this attraction apart "enough" for Busch to build it. I think the Premier SkyRocket II we have is about all that we will see for low-capacity launched coasters at BGW.
Something in my heart keeps telling me: Think Swiss and Think Big.
I'd like to iterate my thoughts as nicely and as quickly as I can:
Tophats...
Intamin...
Launches...
^Likely not happening in 2019. They have 2 launched coasters, and nothing Intamin can do will set this attraction apart "enough" for Busch to build it. I think the Premier SkyRocket II we have is about all that we will see for low-capacity launched coasters at BGW.
Something in my heart keeps telling me: Think Swiss and Think Big.
RE: Project Madrid: New Hamlet? Giga Coaster? 315' Tower?
Agreed. Not only that but BGW doesn't really "repeat" ideas throughout their park. Some other parks like to have coasters that do "similar" things.
They got a classic, a hyper, a dive, an inverted, a woodie, a launch, and a shuttle. I think having another chain lift, non-inverted coaster would be a good thing for them. It would really round out the collection nicely. Having a second launched coaster (even if faster an taller); I think people would question why have it with Verbolten there already. I think a chainlift (or cable) to 315 with a huge drop would be different enough from Apollo to not have people (talking general public here) question why having the bigger one.
Bring Back Questor 87 said:
Agreed. Not only that but BGW doesn't really "repeat" ideas throughout their park. Some other parks like to have coasters that do "similar" things.
They got a classic, a hyper, a dive, an inverted, a woodie, a launch, and a shuttle. I think having another chain lift, non-inverted coaster would be a good thing for them. It would really round out the collection nicely. Having a second launched coaster (even if faster an taller); I think people would question why have it with Verbolten there already. I think a chainlift (or cable) to 315 with a huge drop would be different enough from Apollo to not have people (talking general public here) question why having the bigger one.
RE: Project Madrid: New Hamlet? Giga Coaster? 315' Tower?
I'm not anywhere near convinced about what this ride is, I'm just throwing this out there. I don't believe we will be getting a flyer, at least not at that height. RMC is out also. I'm not going to say no to a wing coaster but I'm going to say no to a 4D.
What else will be so different that is currently being built approaching 300 feet? I wouldn't be at all against a B&M Giga, but if we are talking different the height would be the difference. A B&M Giga would be closer to AC than an Intamin anything compared to Verbolten or Tempesto. Unless we're getting a giant Incredible Hulk ride and instead of a tophat we're looking at a 315 foot cobra roll.
I'm not anywhere near convinced about what this ride is, I'm just throwing this out there. I don't believe we will be getting a flyer, at least not at that height. RMC is out also. I'm not going to say no to a wing coaster but I'm going to say no to a 4D.
What else will be so different that is currently being built approaching 300 feet? I wouldn't be at all against a B&M Giga, but if we are talking different the height would be the difference. A B&M Giga would be closer to AC than an Intamin anything compared to Verbolten or Tempesto. Unless we're getting a giant Incredible Hulk ride and instead of a tophat we're looking at a 315 foot cobra roll.
RE: Project Madrid: New Hamlet? Giga Coaster? 315' Tower?
If BGW really wanted to differentiate they could convert Apollo to the floorless B&M trains and give the new giga traditional trains.
Also, after riding a B&M giga now...the giga experience is so different. On Apollo and others like it the airtime hills are taller and shorter start to End so that the ride is all about the airtime sensation. Their gigas are all about the speed, the feeling of maintaining it, and really moving. The way Invadr really feels like it's just hauling tail through the entire course is the way a B&M giga feels.
If BGW really wanted to differentiate they could convert Apollo to the floorless B&M trains and give the new giga traditional trains.
Also, after riding a B&M giga now...the giga experience is so different. On Apollo and others like it the airtime hills are taller and shorter start to End so that the ride is all about the airtime sensation. Their gigas are all about the speed, the feeling of maintaining it, and really moving. The way Invadr really feels like it's just hauling tail through the entire course is the way a B&M giga feels.
RE: Project Madrid: New Hamlet? Giga Coaster? 315' Tower?
Having just returned from Carowinds (and the eclipse), Fury did not make Intimidator irrelevant. warfelg described it pretty well. Fury delivered the sense of speed, while Intimidator had solid floater airtime and that great turnaround. BGW has much better terrain to work with than Carowinds did, so I'm confident that they will use that to set it apart from I305 and Fury.
On top of that, Carowinds built Intimidator and Fury only five years apart, and Canada's Wonderland got Leviathan only four years after Behemoth. Assuming this is Project 2019, Apollo's Chariot will have had twenty seasons to stand tall before being physically overshadowed.
Having just returned from Carowinds (and the eclipse), Fury did not make Intimidator irrelevant. warfelg described it pretty well. Fury delivered the sense of speed, while Intimidator had solid floater airtime and that great turnaround. BGW has much better terrain to work with than Carowinds did, so I'm confident that they will use that to set it apart from I305 and Fury.
On top of that, Carowinds built Intimidator and Fury only five years apart, and Canada's Wonderland got Leviathan only four years after Behemoth. Assuming this is Project 2019, Apollo's Chariot will have had twenty seasons to stand tall before being physically overshadowed.
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