Is Twisted Cyclone nothing to you??? Lol
Concept Parting Out Fun Spot Atlanta & Rehoming ArieForce One
- Thread starter Tacky3663
- Start date
I honestly completely forgot about it. Never been to SFoG.
That said, the more I sit with it SFMM really makes a ton of sense to me. I know that will be 2 RMC's, but it would be killer in that park, minimal investment, and could hold off doing anything out there for a while.
I like this method of breaking it down, but first and foremost SFOG has an RMC already (twisted cyclone) which eliminates it, and I disagree with how easily you hand-waved the “juice isn’t worth the squeeze parks.”Ok, doing some critical thinking in real time here so sorry if this post ends up long or wandering:
Let's eliminate the parks that are leased land or at risk with CGA and SFDK. And take out the ones operated by Enchanted as well with WoF,SFStLMAA, TGE, VF, Mich Adv.
I think any form of lease back takes out La Ronde and SFMexico. I'll also toss in Qiddiya City in this even though it's basically a name leasing.
Next I want to take out the ones with an RMC already with SFoT, SFNE, SFGAmer, SFFT, KD, CP.
Next, I want to take out KBF because of space limitations.
Next I want to eliminate the "is the juice worth the squeeze" ones (aka is the value there to the park) in Dorney Park (height restrictions), Frontier City (OKC market), SFDL (although I really like this destination), and I'm adding Canada's Wonderland (potential tariff issues).
So that leaves the 3 I can make a good case for but also why not:
Kings Island - KI could really use a RMC, and is sort of a flagship for the new SF. Would be a great move for them to add for a lowered cost a great coaster to round out their collection. But the downside is with CP close enough and SV close enough, would they want both of those world class RMC's that geographically close together.
Carowinds - Like KI it could really use an RMC, it's also a flagship for the new SF, but in addition it has the already prepped spaces it could go into. The case for why not - Carowinds is a flagship park, so wouldn't you want to build them something new ground up for a RMC that would be really unique and custom to the park for the first coaster since Copperhead.
Six Flags Over Georgia - It's literally right there and it could really use an RMC. For a park in the decline, having a world class coaster there would really make a difference. The downside here is that the attendance has been declining, Atlanta isn't a major park to get to, and there would need to be some work.
That leaves me the dark horse park that hasn't been mentioned:
SIX FLAGS MAGIC MOUNTAIN
Needs a new coaster/goodwill
Has an RMC
Has the space
Could use new signature ride
Needs investment without high expense
While it does fail the RMC already test, there's a lot of upsides to putting AF1 here. They could use a working from day 1 signature ride that's world class that won't break the bank. Especially if SFCorp decides that X2 is more problematic than it's worth. They have a lot of places it could go with minimal ride modification. And putting the #7 coaster in this park could really give it the anchor it needs to establish (deeper and more recognizably) the West Coast coaster capital that they lack.
I agree that I don’t see it ending up at frontier city and Darien lake for the reasons you provide, but to me available space is a larger concern than tariffs at Canada’s wonderland (those could easily have changed and disappeared two years from now), although I’m not super familiar with where the park has space. I think if they want to put it at Dorney Park they can find a way to maneuver the layout into it - I don’t see it ending up there before your other two realistic contenders, but I think it’s worth a longer look
What parts do you disagree with? Dorney has the height restriction issues. Frontier City and Darien Lake both suffer the same issue in my mind in that relative to the chain they are 'small potatoes' and they might be next on the chopping block should SF's want to sell more parks.
If there are tariff issues taking it to Canada, they might be better off just getting a new coaster for the cost TBH.
But again, they have the height restriction issues to deal with. I would rather see Dorney get a true modern woodie going through those issues of the height restrictions over a relocated RMC TBH.
I can guarantee you Cedar Point having Steel Vengeance will not have any affect on the decision whether or not to put AF1 at KI. Cedar Point having Magnum, Raptor, and Millennium Force did not stop Cedar Fair from putting a hyper, invert, and giga at KI. And AF1 is smaller in stats so it wouldn't overshadow Steel Vengeance in size.
I also do not see them putting AF1 in a park that already has an RMC Ibox coaster. That would be like putting Tormenta at Cedar Point next to Valravn.
I also do not see them putting AF1 in a park that already has an RMC Ibox coaster. That would be like putting Tormenta at Cedar Point next to Valravn.
Raptor actually did stop them from putting a B&M invert at ki at first. B&M did an exclusivity deal with Cedar Point meaning that Kings Island and Canadas Wonderland couldn't get a B&M invert.
I agree that’s what Dorney should actually get, but I have zero confidence they will anytime soon so you take what you can get.
I’ll reiterate that I agree Frontier City and Darien Lake are parks they should cut bait on and FC would be a bad fit anyways, but I think Dorney makes a lot of sense as a park that - if they want to keep and grow it long term - could use the standout ride in particular and isn’t high enough up the pecking order that they can expect to get it any other way.
Canada’s wonderland should definitely aim for something completely custom and higher capacity, but I’m not convinced they’d be receiving this (especially if it needs modifications) within a timeframe that would make current Tariffs relevant. I think it’s a nonzero possibility it ends up there
Warfelg, I don't see where you categorize SFGAdv as part of your analysis.
That was when they were owned by different companies. Now that they're owned by the same company, it didn't stop CF from adding similar coasters to KI than CP had.
I purposely left it off because I personally think that's where it's landing.
So the italicized - I think that's the issue. I feel they want to keep it and grow it, but at the same time it's a much slower and calculated grow. They have height issues, and I think before having a coaster that creates issues with that, they would be better served using space on a longer family launched coaster. Something like Big Bear Mountain that can hug terrain, be family friendly, and stay under height requirements. Especially given their last coaster was Iron Menace - turning back to the family aspect is a need for them. Thunderhawk, Rocket Express, and the Wild Mouse are about all they have on family friendly at the moment (Steel Force, while able to do families, isn't really family friendly.
Basically I put Dorney in the juice isn't worth the squeeze because of all of that and just frankly where it's at of going to likely always be the third behind SFGAdv and Hersheypark.
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Great Adventure feels like where the betting money should go. SF has to compete with HP in that area, and its not going to be Dorney that is their champion. Only way you compete with HP is really upping the game on the eastern side and keeping Cedar Point competitive on the western side. 2 big coasters plus a park refresh in dining and asthetics for Great Adventure could be the ticket to renewed relevance.
I keep coming back to Carowinds as one of the most logical landing spots.
Part of that is based on some personal experience. I worked pretty heavily with Six Flags during the Cedar Fair merger, particularly around the corporate HQ transition in Charlotte, and had access to several VP-level people. Since I’m a coaster nerd, I naturally asked about Carowinds whenever I got the chance.
There was a pretty consistent belief that Carowinds was going to see meaningful investment over time. The reasons people talked about were Charlotte’s growth, the airport continuing to become a much larger domestic/international gateway, the size of the regional market, and the broader push toward extending park operating seasons. There was even a period where year-round Carowinds was seriously being discussed.
That context is a big reason I think Carowinds is near the top of the AF1 speculation list.
One thing I also think gets misunderstood is the land situation. Carowinds is not some landlocked 150-acre park. Six Flags’ own property disclosures list Carowinds at approximately 400 total acres, about 300 developed and roughly 100 undeveloped. So while fitting a large coaster obviously depends on the exact parcel, infrastructure, wetlands, parking needs, etc., “Carowinds doesn’t have room” by itself isn’t really a convincing argument.
Then there is the coaster cycle. Copperhead Strike opened in 2019, so if AF1 reopened there in 2028 or 2029, Carowinds would be approaching a decade without a completely new major coaster. For a park of Carowinds’ importance, that’s a pretty long gap.
And historically, Cedar Fair already demonstrated that it viewed Carowinds as a park worth trying to elevate. Back in 2013, company discussions with Charlotte revolved around turning Carowinds into Cedar Fair’s major southeastern park and pushing annual attendance toward the 2.5–3 million range. That investment cycle ultimately produced things like Fury 325 and major changes to the front of the park.
Now add the current Six Flags portfolio strategy. They’re shrinking the portfolio and explicitly saying the divestitures allow them to concentrate capital on the parks they’re keeping including new rides, attractions and infrastructure. Carowinds is one of those retained parks.
So my thinking isn’t simply “Charlotte is growing, therefore AF1.” It’s the combination of:
Part of that is based on some personal experience. I worked pretty heavily with Six Flags during the Cedar Fair merger, particularly around the corporate HQ transition in Charlotte, and had access to several VP-level people. Since I’m a coaster nerd, I naturally asked about Carowinds whenever I got the chance.
There was a pretty consistent belief that Carowinds was going to see meaningful investment over time. The reasons people talked about were Charlotte’s growth, the airport continuing to become a much larger domestic/international gateway, the size of the regional market, and the broader push toward extending park operating seasons. There was even a period where year-round Carowinds was seriously being discussed.
That context is a big reason I think Carowinds is near the top of the AF1 speculation list.
One thing I also think gets misunderstood is the land situation. Carowinds is not some landlocked 150-acre park. Six Flags’ own property disclosures list Carowinds at approximately 400 total acres, about 300 developed and roughly 100 undeveloped. So while fitting a large coaster obviously depends on the exact parcel, infrastructure, wetlands, parking needs, etc., “Carowinds doesn’t have room” by itself isn’t really a convincing argument.
Then there is the coaster cycle. Copperhead Strike opened in 2019, so if AF1 reopened there in 2028 or 2029, Carowinds would be approaching a decade without a completely new major coaster. For a park of Carowinds’ importance, that’s a pretty long gap.
And historically, Cedar Fair already demonstrated that it viewed Carowinds as a park worth trying to elevate. Back in 2013, company discussions with Charlotte revolved around turning Carowinds into Cedar Fair’s major southeastern park and pushing annual attendance toward the 2.5–3 million range. That investment cycle ultimately produced things like Fury 325 and major changes to the front of the park.
Now add the current Six Flags portfolio strategy. They’re shrinking the portfolio and explicitly saying the divestitures allow them to concentrate capital on the parks they’re keeping including new rides, attractions and infrastructure. Carowinds is one of those retained parks.
So my thinking isn’t simply “Charlotte is growing, therefore AF1.” It’s the combination of:
- Carowinds being a historically identified growth property
- A large and fast-growing Charlotte/Carolinas market
- Charlotte Douglas making the park unusually accessible for a regional park
- Approximately 100 acres of undeveloped property
- A major-coaster drought that could reach 9–10 years
- Fury already proving Carowinds can become a destination park when Cedar Fair makes a major investment
- Six Flags consolidating its portfolio and redirecting capital toward the stronger remaining parks
- And, separately, conversations I had around the merger that consistently pointed toward further Carowinds investment
The more I think of it the more I see Carowinds as the Plan A. To add on to you list with my own ideas;
- Closest to Atlanta
- Last two coaster surveys for the park have pointed to every major coaster under the sun, like they don't have a clear idea of what they want next and are open to whatever.
- Park attendance, ride capacities, and maintenance can handle it
- Good corporate player, corporate seems to be more involved in the park's future investments than parks like KI and CW
- Schedule for capital is wide open after Rip Roarin' Falls
- Dino's Alive site was very suddenly cleared out recently
Not sure if someone else mentioned it and I missed it, but I think an important thing to consider with SFGADV in this scenario is that it’s more likely than not that another coaster from there will be lost in the next few years, whether it be Medusa, Batman, or maybe even Superman, although that one is probably just going to get a retheme. Many other parks in the chain already have an RMC that’s similar so there’s plenty of reasons to think Great Adventure may be the landing spot. Obviously I’m a homer a bit as it’s my home park and I’d love to have it here, although I have major concerns about the whole…. not being able to change the name thing, if you wanna call it that
AmyUD06
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You know that Raptor was installed 12 years before Cedar Fair owned Kings Island and Canada's Wonderland, right? Different situation now.
Air Force 1 would definitely really help great adventure coaster line up and help it counter Hershey park. Hershey gotten lots of major investments over the years while GA was neglected with removals. Great adventure would have an elite line up possibly beating Hershey among enthusiasts. The park still in rebuilding phase and need another major coaster after BAK to fully replace green lantern. Imagine this:
1. Eltoro
2.Bakunawa
3. Airforce 1
4. Nitro
This would be an outstanding top 4 and would be quite exciting for this park future!
1. Eltoro
2.Bakunawa
3. Airforce 1
4. Nitro
This would be an outstanding top 4 and would be quite exciting for this park future!
I'm going to go ahead and remind all the Great Adventure fans out there that they don't need arieforce. El toro is an ejector airtime machine.Can we PLEASE give Arie to a park that needs an ejector machine like Caro, or KI, or even Dorney? (I know I put gradv in my prediction earlier but after further thought I don't think it'd be a great fit.
AF1 would be neat as a bonus, but GADV doesn't need it.