This is Oktoberfest

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I understand that some folks may not understand the appeal of TIO. However, for me it is a wonderful piece of nostalgia that can serve as a reminder of park origins. One of my favorite childhood memories is visiting the Festhaus with my parents and experiencing the show. I still remember being a little kid mesmerized by the band and stage escalating as the music started to play. Nowadays, I truly look forward to having a beer, enjoying the music, and enjoying a slice of nostalgia. Losing this show truly makes me very sad. To me it is more than just a show, it is a representation of the park's heritage.
 
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One thing I have come to accept, the current park management is not just indifferent to BG heritage, they actively wish to remove it. It is clear that they wish to remove any and all vestiges of AB. If they could I am sure they would get rid of all images related to Old Country.
 
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Honestly, I liked three main season shows: This is Oktoberfest, Mix It Up, and Celtic Fyre. With animal numbers being diminished, and TIO leaving, I seriously am questioning what the park has to offer me over Kings Dominion.

The Clown Band could nearly fill the entire void of not being able to see MIU, I wouldn't need to be concerned about not being able to enjoy Shrubbery at Kings Dominion. The Culinary department at KD seems to be making enough improvements for me to enjoy food at the park. That leaves a very very small number of things, mostly just different ride offerings, Busch Gardens has that KD doesn't.

I never thought the removal of TIO could be such a tipping point in the competition between the two parks, but it truly is. Now, really I'm thinking I'd rather support the park that I see the most hope in, and BGW is definitely not that park.
 
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This is the next worst thing that's happened at BGW since the removal of the old, one-of-a-kind stage in the Festhaus. When my family would visit the park, our first stop was the Festhaus. EVERY time. We didn't feel like we'd really 'arrived' until we entered that place. I have home videos of the women dancers paying so much attention to my (then) little kids, and it bringing tears to my eyes that my kids felt so happy dancing with those kind dancers. I'll never forget it. And I'll never forgive Busch for getting rid of it.
 
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You think the park is going to announce they're getting rid of TIO? Uh, I don't think so, they're going to smooth the news over as much as they can trying to avoid another mass outcry.

That brings me to another thing. I hate to point it out but a large number of people who were truly disappointed, angry, or saddened with the park from the initial removal of TIO left the park permanently in 2012. And with the park also sweeping the news of the show even existing under the rug when it returned in 2013. The park could easily get away with the removal of TIO without the outcry that was experienced in 2012. It was truly a plot put out by Scott to decimate the following of the show right before he could swipe it out from under our feet again. I hate to be the one to point it out, but Scott could actually get away with it this time.
 
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Zachary also said that this is the current plan and plans can change. Miracles wasn't supposed to return this year but it did. I'm not saying TIO will or will not return, I'm just saying plans change so until opening day comes by I won't hold my breath for anything.
 
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I do not think you understand the situation. TIO was not removed due to budget issues as Miracles was, even though that's the reason we will be made to believe by Scott. If Scott wanted TIO to show this season, he would've found a way, as he always has, mostly by forcing cuts on other departments and manipulating the budget.

The cutting of TIO was done fully out of personal agenda, by Scott. We predicted this would happen when the show returned in 2013, and sure enough, going back and reading this thread and others we were correct as to what the future held for the show. TIO did not return last year out of the wise decision Scott made for the wants of the guests, he returned TIO last year because he was forced to, by someone above him. And until another person forces him to bring it back again, he will not show TIO.(As predicted and confirmed by many people, including Zachary) And the person forcing him(most likely corporate) to return the show will not have reason to make him return it this season, as the public will not know before the season starts that it is gone, therefore, no outcry until it is too late.

You can decide for yourself whether or not to believe me, but TIO will be no more this season, mark my words.
 
I can not believe I am about to say this...

Matthew,
Those are some fairly big accusations you have made. What proof do you have that Scott personally cut this show out based on some "personal agenda"?
Do you have a copy of this agenda or is it your gut feelings? Have you heard he has a personal agenda? Unless we can point a a particular document or statement that is on the record and verifiable that Scott has such and agenda, we really need to keep this in bounds.

Look you know I am no fan of the man, far from it. There are plenty of things to dislike here and be upset over, but making such claims only makes us look silly.
 
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I'm only saying what has been reported multiple times by whistle-blowers who have come on the forums. Zachary has even reported the same things those Whistle-blowers have said also:

Zachary said:
It's hard to say. From what I understand though, when Scott is allowed to remove it, he'll likely do so. Everything I've heard indicates that someone else is requiring that it stay there.
Click to expand...

You can choose whether or not to believe whistle-blowers, or me, or Zachary that it is out of Scott Gasparich's hate the show was removed, it's your decision. Also, when I say Personal Agenda, I mean personal interests. He did not remove the show because guests wanted it, he removed it out of his personal opinion on the show.
 
I trust that the show is being removed. Everything about who likes X and wants Y is pure conjecture. Everything we have is hearsay. Until Scott says how he feels on the record, or an Email is leaked or something similar all we have is 3rd hand opinion.

Do I personally believe Scott has an agenda of some kind. Sure, everyone at that level has some kind of agenda. I also believe that he keeps at least part of it close to his chest and tells people things that he wants them to believe and people generate opinions based on actions. Those opinions become conventional wisdom and as it has a tendency to do, the conventional wisdom becomes accepted as fact.

Look the simple fact is when making strong accusations truthiness is not enough you need hard evidence.

As Carl Sagan said, "Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence!"
 
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#BGWLogic

Also, just heard rumors the Eagle Stained glass window is getting replaced with a huge one of Oscar the snail.
 
^ that eagle was bound to go eventually with all these zoology cuts and all...
 
I think the park just needs to do a full on change up of this show. I saw it in 2013 and wasn't too impressed with it. Its pretty much the same show I saw at the park in 2001 minus the rising stage.

Add a few new dance numbers, change the music selection around a bit, anything would help. There have got to be more traditional Oktoberfest song/dance numbers out there than the stuff played in current show. Of course some of the traditional stuff in the current show can stay as well.
 
Actually, it's a different show. Back when the rising stage was around every two years or so song numbers would be added, some would be removed. Some stayed because they were plain traditions and had to remain, because they always had. This includes most of the lyrical songs, all the toasts, the Happy Wonder song, The Chicken Dance and the beer barrel polka are always featured in typically every version of the show. Any remaining song numbers from the most previous versions had they're coreography changed. The park used to always find German traditions, and play them to music, sometimes they weren't even meant to be.

Things that come to mind that are examples of what an amazing show it used to be back when the rising stage was around were some of the coolest dances. I remember going to see the show one year when I was a lot younger. They performed this amazing dance where the entire Festhaus went dark and the dancers performed with lanterns in hand. That dance was perhaps one of the coolest things I've ever seen the park produce. There were other things also, like maypoles that came up from below the stage, and so much more.

While the show may be similar to what you have experienced in the past, it is very much different. The most recent versions of TIO were recycled from 2010, with nearly half of the numbers shaved off.

The Beautiful thing of TIO was that you could go see the same show you had always enjoyed in the past, but it was different, and fresh.

Keeping shows like Celtic Fyre around for six seasons without changing a thing is what makes the GP bored.
 
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