Project 2025/Holzfäller: Big Bad Wolf 2 (B&M Family Invert)

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A large family coaster that doesn't suck is very appealing. It would be better if this was the anchor for a new area though.

I'd love to see some stats on RMC for regular guest satisfaction. I'd put money on it that it's not really high due to intensity (pain for some). Gwazi did not have a long line when I was there last year.
 
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mikes said:
Gwazi did not have a long line when I was there last year.
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I don't think it's fair to base a rides popularity on one visit. You need a more significant sample size to really come to a conclusion based on in-person park visits. I routinely hear of Gwazi having long slower lines on high volume days and have experienced that in person. Six Flags wouldn't have gone bananas with RMCs if they didn't satisfy guests.
 
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CoasterAuditor said:
I don't think it's fair to base a rides popularity on one visit. You need a more significant sample size to really come to a conclusion based on in-person park visits. I routinely hear of Gwazi having long slower lines on high volume days and have experienced that in person. Six Flags wouldn't have gone bananas with RMCs if they didn't satisfy guests.
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Absolutely, but I've heard that has been pretty normal from others that have went.
 
I think everyone in here needs to think for a moment as well, this may not be all on seas, do you all really believe every other park fan page isn’t screaming about how they want their own rmc ? They are the latest and greatest thing I’m sure they are spread thin, I’m sure the demand will be reflected in the prices. Rmc can’t spread them self too thin so I’m sure there is a wait list that may very well be coming in to play.
 
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If anything, RMC is running out of projects. Fire in the Hole track work is done and the vehicles look ready. The only other thing we know about in the pipeline is the dual Raptors at Walibi Holland which are in fabrication now. The available information certainly doesn't suggest they have some crazy backlog.
(This would also explain why they are trying to push into new markets with Wild Moose).
 
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horsesboy said:
Not really you have this area that was designated for an event building at one time but it's to small and tight for a major attraction.
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It's the perfect location for a small family coaster. That, or the Oktoberfest valley near Mach Tower... Or the valley behind San Marco... Or on the site of the Pet Shenanigans theater... Or behind Killarney using the sim building for a station... Or behind Banbury using the valley behind the hamlet... Or the picnic area to slowly expand the park to encompass Festhaus Park again... Or Festa Italia on the site of La Cucina with Rapids' infield and the surrounding valleys... Or even in Festhaus Park but only bordering the flat, guest accessible land... Or literally a long list of ANY other potential places perfect for a family coaster.

What happened to the creative land use that brought us InvadR and DarKoaster?

Fuck.

tursiops said:
No swaying cars no BBW credit from me. That was signature.
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Amen. Don't let them convince you this even a slightly reasonable "New Big Bad Wolf" unless it swings. Big Bad Wolf mattered so much for ONE REASON.

Did I mention, "FUCK!"

Back to article production.
 
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Jwanger93 said:
I think everyone in here needs to think for a moment as well, this may not be all on seas, do you all really believe every other park fan page isn’t screaming about how they want their own rmc ? They are the latest and greatest thing I’m sure they are spread thin, I’m sure the demand will be reflected in the prices. Rmc can’t spread them self too thin so I’m sure there is a wait list that may very well be coming in to play.
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RMC built 2 coasters each year from 2013-2015. It built 4 in 2016. 5 in 2018. 3 in 2019. 1 (scheduled) each in 2020 and 2021 (both opened in 2021). 2 in 2022. 2 in 2023. There's only 1 scheduled each for 2024 and 2025.

They absolutely have the capacity to build more - so no I don't think there's a wait list.


Edit: As for paying homage to BBW. I agree it should swing. But is there a swinging coaster model currently in production? The closest thing I can think of in a current order book is Axis. KumbaK has built replacement swinging trains but only for old coasters.
 
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Just say the name a third time and they'll be summoned.

Halloween GIF by MOODMAN
 
Jwanger93 said:
I think everyone in here needs to think for a moment as well, this may not be all on seas, do you all really believe every other park fan page isn’t screaming about how they want their own rmc ? They are the latest and greatest thing I’m sure they are spread thin, I’m sure the demand will be reflected in the prices. Rmc can’t spread them self too thin so I’m sure there is a wait list that may very well be coming in to play.
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Um? We've been speculating that a Gwazi sister was coming for ~2 years now thanks to information from trustworthy sources. The park WAS (😭) actively considering one for this site. Then ostensibly scrapped what it would have been a signature attraction for the park for an extremely oddly out of the way family coaster? Before the RMC they were actively considering TWO SEPARATE GIGA COASTERS for that plot of land. Also of course it's all on SEAS, SEAS objective as a corporation is shareholder wealth maximization. A $20m roller coaster does not lead to gains on wealth currently, which is what SEAS seems to be focused on, maximizing short term gains based on the budget cuts and other decisions by the company.
 
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There clearly two different sets of wants and grievances here.

And it's intersection of the two that's the real issue here.

Enthusiasts want a thrill coaster. A big one. But the park doesn't have a 42 inch height requirement coaster. In this case the park's needs don't align with what we might want. It's fine to be disappointed by that but you really need to acknowledge this is hole in the lineup.

And then there's the matter of location. And that's where there's some legitimate question about what the hell SEAS is thinking. The park has other locations they can fit a 2500ft long coaster in - which is a track length within 300ft of Verbolten's. This was something that could have been home to something far more substantial - bigger and longer than Apollo's Chariot. And that's a clear waste of potential when you have other options available that don't waste it. Add to that there are already 2 family coasters near this location - a third here doesn't make as much sense as maybe spreading things out and adding one over closer to Italy or England.
 
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^This is what makes me think this was some sort of impulsive decision made by SEAS brass/corporate on a good pitch by B&M on their not Big Bear Mountain family coasters. It really doesn't make a ton of sense to me logistically from a park infrastructure standpoint. Family coasters are 100% a worthy investment for any theme park if we're being honest, having a good coaster that the younger kids can ride and the adults have a lot of fun as well is difference maker for people experiencing a theme park. Big Bear Mountain is a GREAT ride and honestly if we were looking at similar ride to that, I wouldn't complain.

Now stashing a weaker one in an off the beaten path corner, sabotaging space for future development in lieu of something far greater? That just makes me think SEAS just wanted to check the "new ride for 2025" box and move on. They never actually cared about the long term vision of this amazing European Beer Garden with roller coasters like the Busch family did. They never will.
 
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Jpineda96 said:
I can already see it now. Drachen Rising 😭💀
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That idea popped in my head yesterday as well. That would be so weak honestly.

Also PSA: Complaining about this situation to your family, friends, or co-workers (especially superiors) who have 0 interest in theme parks beyond a high level once a year or so visit, is not recommended. You will quickly find yourself at "well they had to consider a ride for everyone!" from pretty much anybody.
 
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CoasterAuditor said:
^This is what makes me think this was some sort of impulsive decision made by SEAS brass/corporate on a good pitch by B&M on their not Big Bear Mountain family coasters. It really doesn't make a ton of sense to me logistically from a park infrastructure standpoint. Family coasters are 100% a worthy investment for any theme park if we're being honest, having a good coaster that the younger kids can ride and the adults have a lot of fun as well is difference maker for people experiencing a theme park. Big Bear Mountain is a GREAT ride and honestly if we were looking at similar ride to that, I wouldn't complain.

Now stashing a weaker one in an off the beaten path corner, sabotaging space for future development in lieu of something far greater? That just makes me think SEAS just wanted to check the "new ride for 2025" box and move on. They never actually cared about the long term vision of this amazing European Beer Garden with roller coasters like the Busch family did. They never will.
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SEAS can bite on a pitch all they want. Picking the location for it is more of a local decision usually though. Unless SEAS just plain didn't want to pay to study and permit another plot of land.
 
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BGWfan said:
If anything, RMC is running out of projects. Fire in the Hole track work is done and the vehicles look ready. The only other thing we know about in the pipeline is the dual Raptors at Walibi Holland which are in fabrication now. The available information certainly doesn't suggest they have some crazy backlog.
(This would also explain why they are trying to push into new markets with Wild Moose).
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On their website three raptors are listed as coming soon with one of those being the Holland project. So they have 2 others in the works but that still doesn't qualify as a "crazy backlog" though.
 
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