Flight of Fear

[Nicole]

It has been depressingly bright in there for the last few years. I agree it detracts from the experience.

For what it worth, the amount of light varies, depending on whether doors are left open. So, without knowing the exact conditions, when you rode, it might have been unusually well lit.

 

[Gavin]

It’s just gravity with brakes I’m pretty sure.

FoF uses LIMs throughout the entire course to move its trains, no drive tires at all.

 

[zachclarke]

Not quite sure what to do with it, but here's a field recording of the inside of the dome if anyone's into that sort of thing.

View attachment fof interior field recording.mp3

 

[ShaynePC]

It has been depressingly bright in there for the last few years. I agree it detracts from the experience.

For what it worth, the amount of light varies, depending on whether doors are left open. So, without knowing the exact conditions, when you rode, it might have been unusually well lit.

Doors must have been open. It wasn't sunlight-bright but it was still bright enough to see clearly. I was expecting something akin to Space Mountain where you're totally lost in a black room, which would have, with the speed and tight turns, been VERY intense. Still had fun, but complete darkness would have made any sickness that resulted worth it, lol.

 

[CoasterAuditor]

Another thing today…..FOF was down quite a bit as well. The vibe wasn’t too happy past Anaconda today in the park which certainly makes sense.

 

[MikeLovesKD]

For those complaining about the light; I know your pain. Long story short, we have talked about this for years. Summer of 2009 was the best summer to experience the ride. I305's electrical line installation, meant that FOF's neon floor lights had to be off. That summer, FOF operate inside a completely dark dome. Yes; there are a few that remember this summer and it was an amazing experience. Ever sense then, the neon floor lights provide visible light inside the dome. It sucks; but it's how KD feels the ride should operate.

Aside from that, it could still be a good experience if it actually incorporated the alien theme. Let's start with the queue area. The current one, dates back to the old Paramount Outer Limits days. The hanger area is where the theme should really start to grab riders. I'll make a list below on how I would revamp this ride.

Ride Name: X-Track 51
Theme: Bureau of Paranormal Activity miscalculated the physics behind dark matter and accidentally opened a portal to another dimension. Their attempts to sustain the gateway were successful, which lead to exploration into this strange area. What awaits on the other side may be the reason why Bravo 5 has yet to return. The base's X-Track program is the only way in and out of the dark outpost.

Top Speed: 60mph
SFX: Fog, Reptile/Alien animatronic, Utter darkness.

Hanger/Station soundtrack: Indoor Queue Soundtrack

 

[Mushroom]

I305's electrical line installation, meant that FOF's neon floor lights had to be off.

Where are you getting your information?

 

[CoasterAuditor]

Want to look into the accuracy of this, but are the FOF twins 6 mph slower than the outdoor Premier Spaghetti Bowls? (..........got a weird craving for Maggianos just now). RCDB lists them at 54 mph and then the outdoor clones go 60 mph. Is that accurate? I guess it would makes sense they amped up the launch a bit on the subsequent models.

 

[Jonesta6]

According to the Dale Brumfield blog post, they had to do a lot of adjustments to get it to launch fast enough to clear the cobra roll consistently - first of their kind for the models.

Once they've been proven at KD/KI, then others were installed elsewhere - highly likely with some design improvements.

I'd be curious if such a speed difference is noticeable since I feel like the enclosed space on FoF adds to the feeling of going faster.

 

[CoasterAuditor]

I doubt 6 mph is that noticeable as I largely never noticed the speed difference until I saw it on RCDB. Got 3 rides on it yesterday since there was no line. Honestly if it was like that every visit I would ride every visit..........well I usually go in thinking that and then a large red structure nearby um........distracts me.

 

[halfabee]

Considering the incredible degree of geometric and dimensional similarity between track designs of the FoF-era and JJ-era spaghetti bowls, and the same relationship between their respective rolling stock, I am comfortable saying a 6-mph difference in their true top speeds is unlikely. While not physically impossible, it would mean nearly a quarter again as much kinetic energy between the latter installation and the former. The designs were not differentially scaled accordingly, at all.

If they are hitting the MCBR/flat-track midpoints of their respective layouts at anything like similar speeds, then it would be very difficult to imagine a difference in launch speed of 10%+, and in kinetic energy of 23%+, between them.

 

[CoasterTalkBob]

Considering the incredible degree of geometric and dimensional similarity between track designs of the FoF-era and JJ-era spaghetti bowls, and the same relationship between their respective rolling stock, I am comfortable saying a 6-mph difference in their true top speeds is unlikely. While not physically impossible, it would mean nearly a quarter again as much kinetic energy between the latter installation and the former. The designs were not differentially scaled accordingly, at all.

If they are hitting the MCBR/flat-track midpoints of their respective layouts at anything like similar speeds, then it would be very difficult to imagine a difference in launch speed of 10%+, and in kinetic energy of 23%+, between them.

Maybe they launch 6mph faster and trim what's not needed just as they enter the spaghetti bowl? I never really paid attention if there was anything there or not. Realistically the launch speeds likely vary drastically the same way that Volcano did since LIM is basically on or off and when it's on it's pushing as hard as it possibly can the entire time. Volcano's advertised speed was all over the place and I'm sure we're looking at a similar situation here. It might make sense to trim to X speed as you enter the spaghetti bowl as that would likely be easier to get the desired speed than having the LIM launch hit a specific speed.

 

[halfabee]

Unless they have been added somewhat recently (been a while since I’ve ridden one), there are no trims at the end of the launch. From an energy standpoint, whatever the LIMs dump into the train is what you get as you enter the bowl.

…Until you hit the MCBR on the FoF clones, of course. But that’s a different matter…

 

[bill s]

Jinx's launch and first half seems slower than FoF. Without the mid course brake, the whole ride's speed is controlled only by the launch, and even then the final corkscrew can be painful with hands up, which isn't a problem at the original designed speed. There is zero chance that Jinx is actually faster, except maybe in unused capability.

 

[CoasterTalkBob]

Jinx's launch and first half seems slower than FoF. Without the mid course brake, the whole ride's speed is controlled only by the launch, and even then the final corkscrew can be painful with hands up, which isn't a problem at the original designed speed. There is zero chance that Jinx is actually faster, except maybe in unused capability.

LIMs aren't capable of easily (if at all) controlling speed. The design is a targeted speed but there is going to be fluctuations between launches based on temperature and weight in the train.

 

[Jonesta6]

Part 17: Reaching the Outer Limits

Kings Dominion’s Flight of Fear Project was certainly no Flight of Fancy Overhead shot of the original crop circle, courtesy Kings Dominion Marketing. On July 18, 1995, Paramount Parks (parent company of Kings Dominion and four other parks) challenged the Kings Island and Kings Dominion...

www.dalebrumfield.net

This claims the LIM speed is adjustable, but through manual manipulation.

This presumably means that it's possible other newer versions of the ride model at other parks could have been slightly adjusted in any given direction, but since force = mass x acceleration, the question is at what point are changes to either input significant enough for the resulting force output to be out of safe operating limits?

 

[CoasterTalkBob]

Part 17: Reaching the Outer Limits

Kings Dominion’s Flight of Fear Project was certainly no Flight of Fancy Overhead shot of the original crop circle, courtesy Kings Dominion Marketing. On July 18, 1995, Paramount Parks (parent company of Kings Dominion and four other parks) challenged the Kings Island and Kings Dominion...

www.dalebrumfield.net

This claims the LIM speed is adjustable, but through manual manipulation.

This presumably means that it's possible other newer versions of the ride model at other parks could have been slightly adjusted in any given direction, but since force = mass x acceleration, the question is at what point are changes to either input significant enough for the resulting force output to be out of safe operating limits?

It's saying exactly what I said:

There was a good reason for that: the LIM speed was adjustable; simplistically, it could be “dialed up” or “dialed down” depending on a network of variables, including temperature and train weight.

Yes, there are adjustments that could be made that would change a general target speed but LIM always would vary on speed depending on the enviornment where LSM does not. It's kind of like throwing a baseball.... if you throw it as hard as you can you'll generally hit a similar speed each time but there will be variance and that speed will also change if I give you a heavier or a lighter baseball than you are used to.

 

[MikeLovesKD]

I doubt 6 mph is that noticeable as I largely never noticed the speed difference until I saw it on RCDB. Got 3 rides on it yesterday since there was no line. Honestly if it was like that every visit I would ride every visit..........well I usually go in thinking that and then a large red structure nearby um........distracts me.

Yes it is. I use to be a regular weekend visitor of Six Flags America. Rode Joker's Jinx enough times to compare the difference between it and FoF. I can honestly say that FoF's launch is a bit faster than Joker's Jinx. But this could be for a number of reasons. FoF's trains are not as big as Joker's. FoF has also had a lot better care than JJ did with Six Flags America's maintenance team. A lot of their rides experienced a lot of downtime throughout the years. KD's FoF was honestly cared for by better maintenance teams. Also, take into consideration that FoF sits comfortable inside throughout the winter season, where Joker has to bare the elements. But in my honest opinion, both rides could use theme enhancement. JJ appears to look appealing during the night when the floor lights illuminate the nice green and purple ride colors. And the menacing noise from the ride, adds to the suspense. Flight of Fear's appearance cannot be seen by spectators.

As for the future of the ride, I can still see it being a good attraction that people love. But it needs some theme enhancement. The only reason I say this is because when things are just left to operate and collect dust; the company might start having second thoughts about keeping it. I've had so many great memories on this ride. Ideas that have came in my head. If I could own this park, Flight of Fear would be the must do attraction next to I305.

 

[CoasterTalkBob]

Yes it is. I use to be a regular weekend visitor of Six Flags America. Rode Joker's Jinx enough times to compare the difference between it and FoF. I can honestly say that FoF's launch is a bit faster than Joker's Jinx. But this could be for a number of reasons. FoF's trains are not as big as Joker's. FoF has also had a lot better care than JJ did with Six Flags America's maintenance team. A lot of their rides experienced a lot of downtime throughout the years. KD's FoF was honestly cared for by better maintenance teams. Also, take into consideration that FoF sits comfortable inside throughout the winter season, where Joker has to bare the elements. But in my honest opinion, both rides could use theme enhancement. JJ appears to look appealing during the night when the floor lights illuminate the nice green and purple ride colors. And the menacing noise from the ride, adds to the suspense. Flight of Fear's appearance cannot be seen by spectators.

As for the future of the ride, I can still see it being a good attraction that people love. But it needs some theme enhancement. The only reason I say this is because when things are just left to operate and collect dust; the company might start having second thoughts about keeping it. I've had so many great memories on this ride. Ideas that have came in my head. If I could own this park, Flight of Fear would be the must do attraction next to I305.

SFA's maintenance team is actually pretty damn good. Rides may go down at times but there is no park that gets rides up faster from downtime than that park. They work hard and take care of their rides.

Nominally I would say both of the rides are likely around the same speed aside from the normal variance in launch speeds which could go both ways depending on when you're at a park. Most of what you're sensing is likely because FoF is enclosed and that adds a sense of speed. The link that @Jonesta6 shared eludes to the fact that there can't been serious differences of speed because of the increase of G force on the rider and/or the potential of not making it through the course.

In short, yea, there's going to be variance but I doubt that variance is always in the same direction where FoF is always the faster ride -- it'll likely often be the other way as well.

 

[MikeLovesKD]

SFA's maintenance team is actually pretty damn good. Rides may go down at times but there is no park that gets rides up faster from downtime than that park. They work hard and take care of their rides.

Nominally I would say both of the rides are likely around the same speed aside from the normal variance in launch speeds which could go both ways depending on when you're at a park. Most of what you're sensing is likely because FoF is enclosed and that adds a sense of speed. The link that @Jonesta6 shared eludes to the fact that there can't been serious differences of speed because of the increase of G force on the rider and/or the potential of not making it through the course.

In short, yea, there's going to be variance but I doubt that variance is always in the same direction where FoF is always the faster ride -- it'll likely often be the other way as well.

Good answer. FoF always felt faster going through the inversions. But to each is own.

Back to what I was saying last week about Cedar Fair investing in the indoor ride department. I believe the park could benefit huge from it. This was experimented with back during the Paramount operation days when the park received Scooby-Doo Boos Blasters and Italian Job Stunt Coaster. Back when all the SFX worked for Stunt Coaster; it was a good ride. Given the fact, it sits so close to Flight of Fear; always pinches my thought of Premier doing something much bigger for the indoor ride department. As I've said; they have a great success in this department.

Since we are in the jungle theme; why not consider doing the Animal Kingdom approach and give us Dinosaurs? Let's consider the amount of space that Anaconda currently sits on. If Stunt Coaster and Anaconda were removed for a half indoor/outdoor attraction; I'd say that a time travel theme with Dinosaurs would be cool. This would be a huge rebound for the defunct Dinosaurs Alive theme section.

Thoughts?