COVID-19’s Impacts on BGW

[Memles]

Hmmm...interesting. I understand from a logistical standpoint that it’s really not feasible to sanitize every time, but I feel it should at least be done more often. People touching other surfaces, their masks, not properly wearing masks, or properly hand washing after the restroom. There’s too much of an unknown variable with the general public (I’m looking at you Karen) that being über cautious isn’t a bad thing. I honestly don’t know if we will go this year and I hate that....I have faith in BGW just not gen pop.

I'll say two things on this. First of all, yes: the current BGW policy is very much operating under the presumption that guests have sanitized their hands before getting onto the ride, and again when they are getting off the ride. And there are certainly enough hand sanitizing stations in queues and outside washrooms and dining/retail locations that this is certainly probable, if of course not guaranteed. Like so much of any virus mitigation strategies in public spaces, BGW's is dependent on shared responsibility, and of course in our current climate I understand why people might be uncomfortable with that.

The second thing, though, is simpler: the reality is that surface transmission, particularly in outdoor areas, is not considered a significant source of viral infection as it relates to COVID-19. It is absolutely theoretically possible, but it requires a set of circumstances (a direct infection of droplets onto the surface, direct and near-immediate contact with that surface by one's hand, direct and near-immediate contact with one's face, in that order) that are more lab-tested conditions than real world ones, especially in an environment where there is an enforced mask policy (which severely limits the droplets an infected individual would release) and there is a clear push to sanitize.

This article in The Atlantic, "The Scourge of Hygiene Theater," is a good read for thinking about how much the focus on sanitization is much more about making us feel safe and that entities like BGW are taking this seriously than they are about addressing high-risk likelihoods. The scientists quoted all agree that it is still important to wash hands/use hand sanitizer, but they collectively agree that the initial concerns about surfaces do not reflect real world conditions, and that airborne transmission is the primary concern with COVID-19.

 

[BGW Family]

IF you can get people to use the sanitizer. Same as getting them to use the masks right. Heck, if everyone would wash their hands as much as they push masks, all might be significantly improved by now. Both surface and mask defense would seem prudent since the CDC currently uses words like "possible" and "suggests"indicating they still don't know how transmission truly works. Again, why not do everything possible to slow this thing down? Even if it "might" help.

CDC - How COVID-19 Spreads

Edit: Are the queue rails being wiped same as the ride surface? I'd think those were more exposed and contaminated. And I tend to ignore the "news" anymore since anyone can find some article or doctor quote that reflects whatever opinion is trying to be pushed. I think reports downplaying surfaces is bad because people are lax at all as is. If they hear it's no big deal, they ignore it. Just like wearing mask is what you need, but still all up in my space. It takes distance, too. Masks are not a brick wall, only a reduction barrier. WHEN they are even worn right.

We take personal responsibly. First-most, we don’t rely on other people to do he right thing. We distance, cover faces, and wash constantly.

 

[Memles]

Edit: Are the queue rails being wiped same as the ride surface? I'd think those were more exposed and contaminated. And I tend to ignore the "news" anymore since anyone can find some article or doctor quote that reflects whatever opinion is trying to be pushed. We take personal responsibly. First-most, don’t rely on other people to do he right thing. We distance, cover faces, and wash constantly

1) There are ambassadors with large spray cans of disinfectant who make their way around the park like they're spraying for bugs, going at tables, and I'm guessing queue lines as well. But honestly, given how little time is ultimately spent in queues, I have never had need to touch a queue rail, and if you did there is likely a thing of hand sanitizer within five feet of me. If someone is concerned about surface transmission, they have the tools at their disposal to be able to mitigate any potential (highly unlikely) contamination of surfaces without having any need to touch their face, which is a necessary part of this whole equation that mask use mitigates against.

2) Ignoring the news is an honestly reckless thing to do in this current environment. Now, it's one thing to not place blind trust in the news: we need to interrogate articles and consider the information within them, as educating ourselves about the virus is a crucial part of the decision making we're all doing amidst this pandemic. When the CDC first changed their guidelines on surface transfer to the qualifying language you cite ("possible" and "not thought to be the main way the virus spreads"), after previously simply suggesting it could spread on surfaces, there was a headline a few weeks later that did the rounds basically saying "Good news, folks, it doesn't spread on surfaces according to the CDC!" And people did read that headline and think "Oh, it could never happen," instead of simply maybe not disinfecting every piece of mail that enters their house and instead just washing their hands before and after opening it, which is really what the approach should be. And so there is danger in any advice that tells people to ignore potential risk, and if you were to read the article I linked to the experts cited within are all clear that people should still be washing their hands. But their specific concern is that businesses/universities/other entities are prioritizing deep cleaning as a strategy because it's a highly visible form of mitigation, when the reality is that upgraded HVAC systems and other forms of improved ventilation represent the greater priority.

You cite this as an issue of personal responsibility, but that's not entirely true: it's a question of social responsibility, and about how our actions impact the health of not just ourselves, but also others around it. And part of that social responsibility is educating yourself as the scientific understanding of the virus shifts and changes, and using that information in order to adjust your behavior. You are absolutely right that "keep distance, cover faces, wash hands constantly" is the best strategy, but it's also the strategy that the park is enforcing, and while they're not going so far as to forcibly sanitize hands their approach (signage, announcements, the hourly deep cleanings) represent what I would argue is an acceptable mitigation strategy for a threat that has never been linked to any significant transmission of COVID-19.

 

[BGW Family]

Yes, next week there will be more "creditable" sources possibly telling us something in reverse again. That is what your article means. Which source is to believed or may be the pinnacle of being right? Like surface contamination, or how long it hangs in the air, or it will die in the heat of Summer, or miliions upon millions are going to die in t e USA. You actaully say I'm wrong and then say I'm right with the best practice of the week. No one expert really knows all about the virus. You can follow whatever you like and be as reckless as you like. If people were personally responsibility, then the question of social responsibility wouldn't be at large as spreading would decrease by following those personal protocols. And ass to ass maskless in a bar or on a beach and not washing up ain't it.

Thank you for your opinion on how I stay safe or that I am reckless, since you know more than all others. I, meanwhile, we be remaining recklessly virus free. Following my guidelines to not contract, nor spread, this junk by not relying on the government, nor people around me to be responsible, to keep me safe.

I do sugest you try this approaach next time.

1) If someone is concerned about surface transmission, they have the tools at their disposal to be able to mitigate any potential (highly unlikely) possible contamination of surfaces without having any need to touch their face, which is a necessary part of this whole equation that mask use mitigates against.

2) Ignoring the news is an honestly, (in my opinon,) reckless thing to do in this current environment. Now, it's one thing to not place blind trust in the news: (but your article is okay) we need to interrogate articles and consider the information within them, as educating ourselves about the virus is a crucial part of the decision making we're all doing amidst this pandemic. When the CDC first changed their guidelines on surface transfer to the qualifying language you cite ("possible" and "not thought to be the main way the virus spreads"), (thank you for putting words in my mouth, read it again. And this the CDC site wording as of today, not mine. I don't belive they know either) after previously simply suggesting it could spread on surfaces, there was a headline a few weeks later that did the rounds basically saying "Good news, folks, it doesn't spread on surfaces according to the CDC!" And people did read that headline and think "Oh, it could never happen," instead of simply maybe not disinfecting every piece of mail that enters their house and instead just washing their hands before and after opening it, which is really what the approach should be. And so there is danger in any advice that tells people to ignore potential risk, (Like cleaning srufaces?) and if you were to read the article I linked to the experts (by who's determination) cited within are all clear that people should still be washing their hands. But their specific concern is that businesses/universities/other entities are prioritizing deep cleaning as a strategy because it's a highly visible form of mitigation, when the reality is that upgraded HVAC systems and other forms of improved ventilation represent the greater priority. (And other "experts" are saying masks do nothing. And other people are saying it's a hoax. And other news says it likley won't hurt childern. AGAIN, NO ONE KNOWS and if scientific proof doesnt show it, it defaults to opinion.)

You cite this as an issue of personal responsibility, but (I don't feel) that's not entirely true: it's a question of social responsibility, and about how our actions (uh, that woyld be personal responsibility) impact the health of not just ourselves, but also others around it. And part of that social responsibility is educating yourself as the scientific understanding of the virus shifts and changes, and using that information in order to adjust your behavior. You are absolutely right that "keep distance, cover faces, wash hands constantly" is the best strategy, but it's also the strategy that the park is enforcing, and while they're not going so far as to forcibly sanitize hands their approach (signage, announcements, the hourly deep cleanings) represent what I would argue is an acceptable mitigation strategy (which is possibly a reason it is still apreading) for a threat that has never been linked to any significant transmission (I recall this being th main thing before masks wree recommended) of COVID-19.

 

[I64 Trekker]

IF you can get people to use the sanitizer. Same as getting them to use the masks right. Heck, if everyone would wash their hands as much as they push masks, all might be significantly improved by now. Both surface and mask defense would seem prudent since the CDC currently uses words like "possible" and "suggests"indicating they still don't know how transmission truly works. Again, why not do everything possible to slow this thing down? Even if it "might" help.

CDC - How COVID-19 Spreads

Edit: Are the queue rails being wiped same as the ride surface? I'd think those were more exposed and contaminated. And I tend to ignore the "news" anymore since anyone can find some article or doctor quote that reflects whatever opinion is trying to be pushed. I think reports downplaying surfaces is bad because people are lax at all as is. If they hear it's no big deal, they ignore it. Just like wearing mask is what you need, but still all up in my space. It takes distance, too. Masks are not a brick wall, only a reduction barrier. WHEN they are even worn right.

We take personal responsibly. First-most, we don’t rely on other people to do he right thing. We distance, cover faces, and wash constantly.

BGW, or any park for that matter, can only do so much here, and the way they have handled things over the course of the weekend, especially as issues were identified and brought to their attention, shows they are busting their a**es to get it right. The park is going above and beyond what authorities are mandating, but I guess that will never be enough for some people.

 

[BGW Family]

And I'm guessing you don't know anyone that has had a bad case of this crud or that have died from it. Hey, as long as it's good enough for you.

 

[I64 Trekker]

And I'm guessing you don't know anyone that has had a bad case of this crud or that have died from it. Hey, as long as it's good enough for you.

And that is the crux of the problem. For some people, it is never enough.

 

[BGW Family]

I'm sorry. You are totally correct. I am the crux of the problem. Death is not enough because some ass-wipe didn't put on a mask nor wash their hands. My apologies.

 

[Nicole]

For what it is worth, I am observing a general lack of enforcement this evening. I have seen several people with their noses sticking out in full sight of park staff, and no one said anything.

 

[Zachary]

For what it is worth, I am observing a general lack of enforcement this evening. I have seen several people with their noses sticking out in full sight of park staff, and no one said anything.

Truthfully, the only policy enforcement I have seen period is on the ride platforms by ride ops. I'm seeing obvious disinterest in enforcement from culinary, merch, and zoo and no one to enforce on paths or in queues. Compliance percentages are still high, don't get me wrong, but it's proving far more of a problem this weekend vs last week.

I ran into a staff member no-nosing their mask today too. Before interacting with them up close, I asked them to cover their nose and they seemed VERY put-out with me. Not a good look for the park. Especially frustrating since their supervisor was standing RIGHT there and saying nothing to the employee.

Anyone know where security is? They seem totally MIA.

 

[Mwe BGW]

people where kicked off of griffon for not having masks

 

[warfelg]

This is disappointing to hear after the good start. Hopefully they don't feel like the good press is out there so they can let up with it.

 

[Memles]

For what it is worth, I am observing a general lack of enforcement this evening. I have seen several people with their noses sticking out in full sight of park staff, and no one said anything.

It’s honestly a complete mess out there: not the kind of chaos that might be happening at other parks, but a far cry from the compliance I saw Wednesday. I had a guest start taunting me for asking him to step back and put on his mask while I was checking out at Trapper’s (long story but he had gone back to get something but took forever so the cashier called me forward), and the amount of no-nosing and chin wearing is much higher.

I’ve decamped to England and have no intention of returning to the park proper.

 

[Ghost of Pretzel Kaiser]

I knew proper enforcement was too good to be true.

 

[warfelg]

I knew proper enforcement was too good to be true.

It's BGW's mantra. Start something well intended and fold like a damn house of cards the minute anyone complains.

 

[Turbo]

I knew proper enforcement was too good to be true.

Will (likely) continue to just get more and more worse.

 

[Zachary]

Trapper's just had three employees behind the counter wearing masks around their chins—zero coverage of mouth or nose. Totally unacceptable—not just park-image-wise, but legally. This is a direct violation of the current orders from Richmond. Needless to say, I'll be reporting them to guest services tonight.

 

[Memles]

Thank you for your opinion on how I stay safe or that I am reckless, since you know more than all others. I, meanwhile, we be remaining recklessly virus free. Following my guidelines to not contract, nor spread, this junk by not relying on the government, nor people around me to be responsible, to keep me safe.

I honestly, truly, earnestly appreciate that your approach to personal responsibility is to take absolute precaution and limit risk, and I would never suggest that you personally represent a problem in this case (and didn't, just as I didn't put words in your mouth by saying you're citing the CDC). The problem is that there are people out there who aren't being cautious, and potentially being outright reckless, and it's because they don't trust or respect government public health messaging, or because they're convinced the media is lying to them. We need to be skeptical of what we consume, but we also need to be willing to trust experts and to learn as much as possible about the virus. This is not to say we should then make reckless choices based on that information, but rather that our collective ability to live with this virus (because this country's approach to the virus has left us no other choice) depends on our collective education as much as our collective action. The two need to be linked. I'm glad that despite your choice to ignore the ongoing discourse around the virus, you've remained defaulted to safe courses of action. But most who do the same are unlikely to follow the same path, and that's a larger concern that needs to be addressed.

 

[Memles]

Trapper's just had three employees behind the counter wearing masks around their chins—zero coverage of mouth or nose. Totally unacceptable—not just park-image-wise, but legally. This is a direct violation of the current orders from Richmond. Needless to say, I'll be reporting them to guest services tonight.

I realize it's because it was less busy on Member Preview, and they were running the two kitchens and had Suzy running traffic, but Trapper's was a gong show on every level tonight. No one in the actual line was respecting the social distancing stickers, which are placed in a way to create six feet of distance taking both sides of the barrier into account. I saw multiple people re-enter the food area to refill drinks or ask questions, completely violating distancing in the process. And then there's no distancing stickers for the checkouts at all, leaving people to basically fend for themselves and hope the people in front of and behind them are respecting their space.

To expand on the story above, there were two men two places in front of me in line to check out who had their masks on their chins (they had no food, they were in line for drinks). One put his mask up when they got to the cashier, but the other did not, and the latter then went back into the building to get bottles of water they hadn't realized were back in the food area. I was next in line at this point, and he didn't reappear for like a minute after his friend had finished checking out, so the cashier called me up, and started ringing up my order. It was at that point that he returned with the bottles of water, mask on his chin, and stood a couple of feet behind me. I asked him to move back, and pointed out he wasn't wearing a mask, and basically he then spent the rest of my transaction taunting me, asking if I could tell he was six feet away now.

And look, this is some normal "assholes go to theme parks too" stuff on the surface, but if they had someone in the role Suzy was in directing traffic at Trapper's tonight, it probably wouldn't have happened. The fact is that cashiers and food services workers are not enforcing the mask policy, and honestly they shouldn't have to be: the park needs to have people in key locations (Trapper's) as well as key thoroughfares (Wolf Haven feels like the spot where people most often drop their masks without eating or drinking) that creates a meaningful check and balance on the system. The issues with employees not wearing masks is a whole other level of problem, but after a fairly safe experience on Wednesday tonight made me feel like returning to the park is tossing a coin if this is where enforcement stands five days in.

 

[Ghost of Pretzel Kaiser]

This seriously is making me question about if I want to go to the park again if not even the staff are doing what they’re supposed to be doing. I was afraid that this would happen and genuinely saddened that this is happening. The park should have staff in a safe place in queues to enforce and be very liberal about removing individuals from the park.

Edit: I blame the culture that refused to take the virus as seriously as it should have, not that anyone here has ever said anything to belittle the concern about the virus or that I harbor bitterness towards those individuals and I think they should go lick used hospital ICU PPE.