I guess KD has had enough of people asking when they'll open 
COVID-19 Impacts on Kings Dominion
- Thread starter belsaas
- Start date
Kings Dominion has now expressed their disappointment with the Phase 3 restrictions.
""Although we respect the decisions of our state officials, the restriction of limiting our park to just 1,000 guests does not reflect the large volume of space available to accommodate recommended social distancing protocols, and essentially suggests the state will only allow us to have 5 people per operating acre," said Kings Dominion spokesperson Maggie Sellers in a statement to CBS 6."
www.wtvr.com
""Although we respect the decisions of our state officials, the restriction of limiting our park to just 1,000 guests does not reflect the large volume of space available to accommodate recommended social distancing protocols, and essentially suggests the state will only allow us to have 5 people per operating acre," said Kings Dominion spokesperson Maggie Sellers in a statement to CBS 6."
Kings Dominion 'disappointed' with Phase 3 restrictions on amusement parks
Kings Dominion has expressed disappointment with the restrictions applied to amusement parks under Phase Three of the governor's reopening plan.
www.wtvr.com
Here is KD’s full statement regarding the Phase 3 guidelines.
Kings Dominion is disappointed to hear as part of the Phase 3 announcement that the restrictions applied to smaller indoor attractions and venues are being improperly applied to large amusement parks, such as Kings Dominion. Although we respect the decisions of our state officials, the restriction of limiting our park to just 1,000 guests does not reflect the large volume of space available to accommodate recommended social distancing protocols, and essentially suggests the state will only allow us to have 5 people per operating acre.
As professional amusement park operators with an exemplary safety record, we are experts at managing risks and following protocols. We have developed protocols to safely reopen our parks in accordance with governmental and CDC directives, Virginia Department of Health, medical professionals, and industry standards that are specifically responsive to the COVID-19 crisis. Many amusement parks across the United States have already successfully reopened with similar protocols.
Our capacity-controlled, family-friendly experience, coupled with the operational expertise of our seasoned park professionals, provides for an environment where predictable observance and enforcement of social distancing and COVID-19 protocols can be achieved. We are hopeful that our plan for re-opening will receive serious consideration and that a separate decision will be made in short order for amusement parks in Virginia.
Kings Dominion is disappointed to hear as part of the Phase 3 announcement that the restrictions applied to smaller indoor attractions and venues are being improperly applied to large amusement parks, such as Kings Dominion. Although we respect the decisions of our state officials, the restriction of limiting our park to just 1,000 guests does not reflect the large volume of space available to accommodate recommended social distancing protocols, and essentially suggests the state will only allow us to have 5 people per operating acre.
As professional amusement park operators with an exemplary safety record, we are experts at managing risks and following protocols. We have developed protocols to safely reopen our parks in accordance with governmental and CDC directives, Virginia Department of Health, medical professionals, and industry standards that are specifically responsive to the COVID-19 crisis. Many amusement parks across the United States have already successfully reopened with similar protocols.
Our capacity-controlled, family-friendly experience, coupled with the operational expertise of our seasoned park professionals, provides for an environment where predictable observance and enforcement of social distancing and COVID-19 protocols can be achieved. We are hopeful that our plan for re-opening will receive serious consideration and that a separate decision will be made in short order for amusement parks in Virginia.
Yep ! And now with both Busch’s and kings dominion’s dissatisfaction, they should push for an exemption or Sue!
So Kings Island is doing this now! It’s a very limited selection at the moment, but a very cool idea, nonetheless! I hope KD does the same soon. I would happily buy an Intimidator 305 or Twisted Timbers mask!
Gotta say, I really like a lot of these designs... except this one. What the hell were they thinking with this one.So Kings Island is doing this now! It’s a very limited selection at the moment, but a very cool idea, nonetheless! I hope KD does the same soon. I would happily buy an Intimidator 305 or Twisted Timbers mask!
For the record, this isn't a joke. I couldn't make this stuff up if I tried.
I briefly stopped off at Doswell to get something to drink on my way home this afternoon. KD has already setup what appears from the road to be a decent sized prescreening area under tents outside of the main gate. This seems to go with what I have heard reported other places that the parks were caught rather off guard with the 1,000 person cap and that they had been anticipating in phase 3.
For what it's worth, I've confirmed this with a number of people familiar with the situation now. KD and BGW were both assuming they would be able to open near the start of July and even started to spin up to facilitate that expected timeline. Needless to say, when the start of July rolled around, the greenlight they were betting on never materialized and the scale up was rolled back again.
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I happen to live in the greater Washington Metropolitan area. Cedar Fair could sue the state of Virginia if the following were considered in their argument. Six Flags America is open. Hershey Park is also operating. Both those parks have attendance that come from the greater Washington Metropolitan area. The same goes for Kings Dominion. On weekends; most of KD's attendance is north of the park; which is the greater Washington Metropolitan area; once you pass Fredericksburg, VA. If SFA and Hershey are able to cater towards that population; then so can KD. So the argument against the Governors decision would consist of park stats of Six Flags America(Largo, MD) and Hershey Park(Hershey, PA). Cedar Fair could call for MD-Governor and PA-Governor to testify as professional witnesses for their decision on the states capacity number for their big regional theme parks. Six Flags America would probably be their strongest testimony. Six Flags America is located in Prince George's County which currently consist of a population size of 909,327 residents. Neighboring Counties include Charles County, Montgomery County, Anne Arundel County, Calvert County and etc. The park is also a 10 to 15 minute drive from the Woodrow Wilson Bridge; which serves as the boarder from MD into VA; on the PG County side. Norther VA Counties who are relatively close to Six Flags America would include Alexandria City-Fairfax County, Fairfax County and Arlington County. All three of those VA counties play a major participant of norther VA counties who visit Kings Dominion. With all the facts being considered, one could argue that VA Governor could give KD a higher capacity number.
KD pointed out some good facts; that the park sits on a lot of acres. Being locked at 1,000 capacity limit; would give the experience of a empty void of much unused park space. There are music venues in the DMV area that hold well over 1,000 people. When you consider this number in a regional theme park that is using 400+ acres; it is questionable whether or not that 1,000 park participants would even see each other while attending KD. Then you add the social distancing protocols on rides; it questionable whether or not trains for rides would even be able to fill even a third of the train, given the number of rides KD has. A regular visitor would feel as if they had to ride most of the rides alone, at a 1,000 person capacity.
In my honest opinion; I don't think the Governor of VA realizes how big KD is. Bush Gardens could post the same argument. Being in Bush Gardens with 1,000 person capacity would feel like a western ghost town. The park is big. KD and Bush should create a full fledged 3D model of their park and simulate what a 1,000 person capacity would look like with every ride, including shows in operation. I am almost 100 percent positive that the court would agree with my theory of being in a deserted theme park in the middle of the summer.
KD pointed out some good facts; that the park sits on a lot of acres. Being locked at 1,000 capacity limit; would give the experience of a empty void of much unused park space. There are music venues in the DMV area that hold well over 1,000 people. When you consider this number in a regional theme park that is using 400+ acres; it is questionable whether or not that 1,000 park participants would even see each other while attending KD. Then you add the social distancing protocols on rides; it questionable whether or not trains for rides would even be able to fill even a third of the train, given the number of rides KD has. A regular visitor would feel as if they had to ride most of the rides alone, at a 1,000 person capacity.
In my honest opinion; I don't think the Governor of VA realizes how big KD is. Bush Gardens could post the same argument. Being in Bush Gardens with 1,000 person capacity would feel like a western ghost town. The park is big. KD and Bush should create a full fledged 3D model of their park and simulate what a 1,000 person capacity would look like with every ride, including shows in operation. I am almost 100 percent positive that the court would agree with my theory of being in a deserted theme park in the middle of the summer.
I think the total size of the park is a misleading statistic. If it were an open field, that would matter. The fact is, however, that guests are restricted to pathways, which are often crowded and naturally constricted.
Additionally, since management of the pandemic was specifically delegated to the states, the choices of Pennsylvania and Maryland don’t seem very relevant to the calculations being made by the government of Virginia. Every state ended up with different resources and infection rates. Unless there is specific evidence that an overwhelming majority of guests come from NOVA, the governor must take into account data from across the Commonwealth. I, personally, don‘t want Virginia opening up prematurely, just because other states were at different stages of fighting the disease or simply jumped the gun and opened too quickly.
Given that we are once again seeing increases in the number of cases increasing in Virginia, it doesn’t seem reasonable to encourage people to go to any venue with large crowds. As I have said before, in my opinion the problem isn’t that the parks are closed, but that other places are open.
Additionally, since management of the pandemic was specifically delegated to the states, the choices of Pennsylvania and Maryland don’t seem very relevant to the calculations being made by the government of Virginia. Every state ended up with different resources and infection rates. Unless there is specific evidence that an overwhelming majority of guests come from NOVA, the governor must take into account data from across the Commonwealth. I, personally, don‘t want Virginia opening up prematurely, just because other states were at different stages of fighting the disease or simply jumped the gun and opened too quickly.
Given that we are once again seeing increases in the number of cases increasing in Virginia, it doesn’t seem reasonable to encourage people to go to any venue with large crowds. As I have said before, in my opinion the problem isn’t that the parks are closed, but that other places are open.
Wouldn't KI run into the same issue being open? I only make that comparison because the parks are similar in ways. KD is about 30 minutes south of Fredericksburg and 30 minutes north of Richmond. KI is located 30 minutes outside of Cincinnati. A similar location could be made with SFA and Washington DC. SFA being about a 20 to 30 minute drive from the city of Washington. In no doubt in my mind, am I saying the cases have not increased. But has the consideration been taken into account that the amount of testing has increased; which made it appear as if the number of cases rose. Not disputing your post; but even in my state; this so called number theory was brought up. When the Governor got new testing kits; the hospitals began testing more people. So the number of cases were reported as increases, when in reality the amount of people who were infected, always had it. Only after that, could a more accurate number be reported on in the state of Maryland. Overall, our state which consist of 6 million plus residents has been doing a good job with it's reopening process. I will not say how many of those residents have visited Six Flags America, for the simple reason that I do not know. All I was doing in my recent post was posting an ideal theory of how populated the area around SFA is as compared to KD.
In actuality, SFA is a lot smaller than KD. But I'd assume that the social distancing protocols with SFA are very similar to KD. SFA does not even run in a complete loop like KD does; so the procedures were probably a lot tighter than what KD's were.
In actuality, SFA is a lot smaller than KD. But I'd assume that the social distancing protocols with SFA are very similar to KD. SFA does not even run in a complete loop like KD does; so the procedures were probably a lot tighter than what KD's were.
This.
I think if either KD or BGW were to try to sue Governor Northam, they've missed their window of opportunity. If they had sued right away, it's possible that Northam could have felt the pressure like Governor Mike DeWine did in Ohio, but now it would not make the parks look good at all if they sued to reopen now that numbers are starting to go back up in Virginia.
My main problem with the original Phase 3 was the fact that bars could reopen before theme parks. Theme parks have shown that they have taken extra precautions when it comes to requiring masks, cleaning rides, and checking for temperature, but I have not seen that same dedication from bars. When Northam changed his mind at the last minute and kept bars closed during Phase 3, it made me less mad about KD and BGW being closed, if I'm being honest.
My guess is that we won't be moving into a "Phase 4" anytime soon due to the increase in VA numbers, but I hope that we can visit our beloved local theme parks this season. I do feel that Northam has good intentions for his decisions, even if it doesn't make full sense at face value and it goes against what we want.
Once again, it is a fallacy to judge the decisions of the government of Virginia based those of any other state. President Trump explicitly chose to leave management of the virus to the states. As a result, Virginia has different resources and risk tolerances than either Maryland and Ohio. In fact, until recently not everyone could get tested yet in the Commonwealth, so we still lack the comprehensive monitoring that other localities enjoy. Until very recently unless you were showing symptoms, have had contact with someone diagnosed with COVID, or are a caregiver to a member of a vulnerable population, you could not be tested in Virginia.
Perhaps Governor Northam is being overly cautious; perhaps Maryland and Ohio opened their parks too soon; or perhaps the variables are completely different in each state. Regardless, the comparisons are not good ways to judge the Virginia governor’s decisions.
What are the cons if KD misses an entire season while SFA and Hershey continue safe operations all the way through the Fall and Christmas season. Let's just pretend that Northam holds the number to 1,000 to the 2021 season. Company's are filing bankruptcy left and right. Cedar Fair ha said they are in ways recession proof. But I'm beginning to doubt how the company will deal with property tax without bringing in any revenue at some of their parks. But again; we are just focusing on VA right now. I'm a Maryland resident but we also see VA news. I'd like to believe that Northam is thinking about the safety of people in VA. But has he taken into account that many people in Northern Virginia travel into MD on a day to day basis? This obviously has also been considered by Maryland Governor; Larry Hogan. He could have easily seen the number of cases in VA growing and chose to do the exact same thing that Northam did. To make you feel better; I anticipated him doing this, when the number of cases in VA and DC, went up during the protest. Which could have easily resulted in Six Flags choosing to keep SFA close.
I haven't been to SFA since 2009 because of the lack of attractions over the past decade. Since then, all my visits were at KD. Many Maryland residents drive down to KD at least once or twice a summer. Generally they choose to go on a Saturday or Sunday, when the park is busy. Potentially we would be taking the risk venturing down into the southern part of VA. I took a great deal of thinking about this. Before KD announced they wouldn't be opening; I'd contemplated the risk of going to the park and possibly bringing back, "you know what"; to my house. Same thing with my buddy who once lived in Ashland. He was on the phone with me, calculating how much money plane flights from Kansas City would be, to Richmond; so that he could get a visit or two in at KD. Not many people do this much planning for SFA; if many people would even want to go there at all. But with KD being closed; it doesn't leave many options. Either there or Hershey.
Overall; Nicole; I am really enjoying this conversation. Who ever thought we would ever experience a season where KD does not operate.
I haven't been to SFA since 2009 because of the lack of attractions over the past decade. Since then, all my visits were at KD. Many Maryland residents drive down to KD at least once or twice a summer. Generally they choose to go on a Saturday or Sunday, when the park is busy. Potentially we would be taking the risk venturing down into the southern part of VA. I took a great deal of thinking about this. Before KD announced they wouldn't be opening; I'd contemplated the risk of going to the park and possibly bringing back, "you know what"; to my house. Same thing with my buddy who once lived in Ashland. He was on the phone with me, calculating how much money plane flights from Kansas City would be, to Richmond; so that he could get a visit or two in at KD. Not many people do this much planning for SFA; if many people would even want to go there at all. But with KD being closed; it doesn't leave many options. Either there or Hershey.
Overall; Nicole; I am really enjoying this conversation. Who ever thought we would ever experience a season where KD does not operate.
Not necessarily just this week the state dropped a couple of cases against venues that had refused to follow earlier restrictions. At least one state senator has said his office has heard back channel rumblings that they dropped them because they were concerned about trying the case and losing and possibly weakening their powers of enforcement over rules that are no longer in effect. The fact that the state is allowing some venues with similar footprints to operate with little or no restrictions but is placing a significantly disruptive burden on the parks is certainly questionable. The reason Ohio dropped the restrictions so fast was that many legal experts pointed to the burden being on the state to show significant evidence that the parks were not safe to operate not on the parks to proof that they could. The fact that parks in several other states have opened without any documented negative effects would booster a case by BGW and KD significantly. My understanding is that the parks as well as others in the industry are taking an approach of trying to work with the state instead of fighting if but I imagine that at some point if the state is unwilling to work with them s lawsuit is likely.
To make this point the state is allowing Go karts Plus to operate at 50 percent capacity which is I believe 250 people with no gate system to enforce that limit, no reservation or tracking of who is coming and going, and no health screening. Can anyone explain to me how that poses less of a risk then BGW just down the road operating at 5,000 which is about 15 percent capacity with both a gate system to insure that they stay in that limit and a reservation system that logs every guest, and a temp check and screening at the entrance? If you are the state you have to show why one of these poses to big of a risk to allow and the other is safe enough to permit.
I’m quite sure that has been considered.
And the first stop on that cognitive train probably was, “Well, increased testing isn’t causing all this death lately, so...”
If the argument is that there’s a “catch up” effect in the testing, and that some proportion of the cases being spotted now are not new, then that would suggest (1) people remain detectably infected and presumably contagious for a long time upon contracting COVID-19, which is a Really Bad Thing; and (2) HOLY SHIT this many people have been infected and undetected all this time??? Good god.
The answer to any of these situations is the same, since in this hypothetical scenario they all supposedly lead to the same aggregated collection of testing stats: keep testing until it becomes clear that the “catch-up” effect has been caught up to. If infection rates aren’t actually rising then you will catch up, and then suddenly the positive-test rate will quickly fall for no (other) discernible reason. Then it is reasonable to go ahead and start talking about large-crowd venues, pending the new stats.
And if you don’t see that drop-off, then oops... it appears there’s little to no catch-up effect after all.
Two weeks ago, Norfolk's percentage of tests coming back positive was at roughly 7%. This week, that number hit 14%. The rise in the number of cases is not solely due to increased testing: the rate of positive tests is rising faster than the number of tests being completed, which is exactly the scenario that is happening in states like Arizona, Texas, and Florida on a wider scale.
Right now, Virginia's state-wide numbers are encouraging, but locally in Hampton Roads (a key market for BGW, albeit less key for KD, although they're going to be a package deal so one will affect the other) the virus is spiking among younger populations, who are less likely to be hospitalized themselves but who are nonetheless able to transfer it to others in high-risk groups. I fully expect that Northam will be introducing a modified Phase 3 for Hampton Roads sometime this week, which is the kind of backward slide that makes the idea of slicing out space for the parks to open seem highly unlikely.
Not to make everyone emo or anything, but there’s a bunch of tents for temperature scans outside the entrance of the park. Really solidifies the theory that this 1,000 person cap on entertainment was last minute and not expected to include Virginia theme parks.
