The State of the Park: Busch Gardens Williamsburg

[Nicole]

I see a lot of unsupported assertions.

Clearly the level of culinary variety and theming is "viable," since they did it for decades.

We have been watching them carefully since before 2016. I would like a systematic analysis of the culinary scene since the InBev sale, before making any claims about the timeline or causes. It is worth noting (just a single data point, of course) that we thought F&W was improved in 2017: 2017 Food & Wine Festival: More Thoughts & Highlights – BGWFans

I understand the "point of bases." We once again lack the data to make assumptions about how KD supports its menus.

 

[Jonesta6]

I don't think we should be comparing the specifics of KD's menus to BGW's as much as the overall quality and variety of each operation.

However, can anyone remember what the menus were during AB's years?

I think most remember portion sizes and overall quality being good, and I remember slaying some mile high sandwiches and breadsticks, but I can't remember there being a whole lot of different menu items everywhere. Yes, there were certainly specialty items available, and lots of things like fries and side salads that seemed to be available everywhere, but just focusing on entrees I can't think there were more than maybe 20ish different items around the park.

 

[Mushroom]

I just counted some of KDs offerings:

6 places serve some variety of pizza. I would easily bet on the dough, sauce, cheese, even majority of the toppings is the exact same - the difference is some have signature styles you can’t get at the other.

Which 6 places did you find that serve pizza at KD? I can only think of 3 places at KD that serve pizza, and KD’s 2022 dining guide seems to agree. Sorry to be nitpicky, but you’re basing a core part of your argument on the assumption that KD’s restaurants share similar bases, but your evidence doesn’t seem to add up.

 

[warfelg]

Which 6 places did you find that serve pizza at KD? I can only think of 3 places at KD that serve pizza, and KD’s 2022 dining guide seems to agree. Sorry to be nitpicky, but you’re basing a core part of your argument on the assumption that KD’s restaurants share similar bases, but your evidence doesn’t seem to add up.

Sorry I messed that up. But yes I’m basing my core on that based on my experience on F&B experience. So three places with pizza - you honestly don’t think the base of that or other doughs used in the park are the exact same doughs?

 

[Bring Back Questor 87]

I believe part of the issue is that BGW knows that they've got us by the balls/ovaries once we've entered the entrance gates, and cannot bring our own platters of food to enjoy when we become hungry. We are beholden to whatever they are serving, our displeasure with the portions, variety, or taste be damned. They know you have no choice but to choose the choices they offer. Is this always right? Hell no.

As someone who works at an international airport, I can see some similarities. The restaurants are run by a concessions contractor and the menus are fixed (usually limited to fewer options at a far higher price point than what you find outside of the airport). They know you have no choice when running to flight in a secured area unless you want to leave and come back at your own inconvenience after finding a better option. Is this always right? Hell no.

I see why BGW has not been bending backwards for better menus, unless we give them hell for it. The parents of families I see at Busch just seem to "suck it up" and dish out the Visa for $70 of bullshit food to appease the kids, fill a hole, and move on. I miss the days when I could tell my friends that up to 40% of the reason I went to the park was to enjoy the ambiance and the quality of the food/drink, which for decades was the case.

I will encourage those that I know outside of this forum to be loud about the experiences they are having in a constructive and effective manner, as otherwise, it will be nothing more than carnival style food at airport prices as the norm.

Maybe its time for a widely-published side-by-side comparison of what Williamsburg wrongfully whips up, versus what Doswell appears to be doing quite well...

 

[warfelg]

I see why BGW has not been bending backwards for better menus, unless we give them hell for it. The parents of families I see at Busch just seem to "suck it up" and dish out the Visa for $70 of bullshit food to appease the kids, fill a hole, and move on. I miss the days when I could tell my friends that up to 40% of the reason I went to the park was to enjoy the ambiance and the quality of the food/drink, which for decades was the case.

Nothing quite speaks like a wallet and unfortunately not enough people have done so.

 

[Bring Back Questor 87]

Nothing quite speaks like a wallet and unfortunately not enough people have done so.

Truth, and sadly so. People still have money to burn when they choose BGW...it seems,

 

[warfelg]

Truth, and sadly so. People still have money to burn when they choose BGW...it seems,

Yea - and this is where I look at it from. I'm not trying to be dismissive of those who long for what the park used to be, but obviously there's little care to go back to it. And people keep spending their money at the park, so SEAS isn't incentivized to change anything about what they are doing. And if they keep trying to offer lots of different things through the park, the only way this will go is to continue to spiral downward. This is why I bring up the thought that I wouldn't mind them going to a 'outsourced' F&W deal so they don't have to worry about their expenses with that. It's why I bring up simplifying their F&B program to some level so they can focus on making a few good meals rather than huge amounts.

 

[Thriller]

From my visit a Christmastown, I find that they already reduced their menu at every location that was actually open. For example, the Festhaus was no longer carry in corn beef sandwiches and there were only a couple platters to choose from at the smokehouse.

The food quality is such garbage , the selection is so limited, and the prices are so high plus a 5% surcharge that I will probably never eat at the park again. It’s very easy to eat before and after visiting.

I did not think I would see the day when kings dominion is miles ahead of Busch Gardens in food service and selection. Plus they offer a season meal pass that makes the meals very reasonable.

 

[WDWRLD]

BGW needs to restore food operations from a backup of around 2005 or earlier. Quality, quantity, offerings, and cost all need to be reconsidered. Do away with Food and Wine, Mardi Grasand focus on CT and HOS. The rest of the year focus on just running all its resturaunts the best they can be. They need to go back to their old menus,bring back the Torte Cake, the Mile High corned beef, the smokehouse sampler, open Josephines, Marcos menu back to before it was Marcos, bring back the pizza place in Festa. Affordable prices, consistant operating hours right up to park closing and people will know they can plan on eating in the park once again. Years and years ago we as locals would go to the park just to eat as the highlight of going. I have very fond memories of the chicken place and eating in the small table area overlooking Lemans, or having pizzas and breadsticks overlooking roman rapids and putting way too many quarters in the water squirters. I can remember getting the brisquite from the place that is now trappers snacks and where trappers is was the ticket windows for the Royal Palace. They turned out some amazing BBQ back then. Get the park back to some solid food selections that you can count on and have some snacks that people want. Then have special limited time only food items that people (locals) will go out of their wat to get. This crap of having the same old cupcake with basic flavors they they sell day in and day out and just putting red white and dlie icing and calling it a July 4th special isnt going to cut it.

 

[Jonesta6]

3 rivers smokehouse reference ftw - that place always had a line even though it was one of the pricier options... And Pierce's is just down the road

 

[Nicole]

I'm not trying to be dismissive of those who long for what the park used to be, ...

I find this statement, ironically, to be dismissive, itself.

I can't speak for anyone else here, but I am not driven by nostalgia. I am not opposed to change. I am opposed to degradation of quality. When the park introduces new, themed experiences, I judge them on their own merits; I don't decry them for being different than whatever Busch did in the 70s and 80s. (See: the Food & Wine Festival) I only referenced the decades of past performance to highlight that the variety, quality, and theming people want is demonstrably feasible.

 

[warfelg]

I only referenced the decades of past performance to highlight that the variety, quality, and theming people want is demonstrably feasible.

That decades of past performance however was under a massively different ownership structure. Do we have the ability to see the performance of the parks at the time? It could be that it was demonstrably feasible because they might not have been making money on it and possibly didn't care to.

I am not driven by nostalgia. I am not opposed to change. I am opposed to degradation of quality.

I'm a little confused then, because I want to see the same thing - I just don't think flipping a switch and going back to the way it all was is feasible.

I find this statement, ironically, to be dismissive, itself.

I'm sorry it comes off that way, but for someone that doesn't have a long history of the park continually hearing "they can do that because they used to do this" is quite dismissive and comes off as not being allowed to have an opinion due to not having the same history. Personally, I've never had the experience or quality that gets described on here. So I don't have that to compare it too.

EDIT -
I want to add, SEAS ownership can and needs to do better. But I don’t expect them to be going all the way back to that style of running the parks. They have shown that they have little interest in doing that. I would just hope that they do better than they have been doing, let alone what the park has historically been.

 

[Zachary]

I don't need 90s BGW dining back. I need, like, at minimum, 2017 BGW dining back. I don't even need them to roll back all the massively-outpacing-the-industry price increases.

At the end of the day, I just want a nice variety of medium-quality, thematically-appropriate food served to me warm with prompt and polite service at astronomical theme park prices.

Right now we get a bare bones selection of often-borderline-inedible food served cold and stale after a one hour wait by people who are often visibly angry that we exist despite the already astronomical prices.

 

[warfelg]

I don't need 90s BGW dining back. I need, like, at minimum, 2017 BGW dining back. I don't even need them to roll back all the massively-outpacing-the-industry price increases. At the end of the day, I just want a nice variety of medium-quality, thematically-appropriate food served to me warm with prompt and polite service at astronomical theme park prices.

Right now we get a bare bones selection of often-borderline-inedible food served cold and stale after a one hour wait by people who are often visibly angry that we exist despite the already astronomical prices.

I very much agree - with the thought that you can do a thematically-appropriate food where parts of it are shared cross eateries.

Like, I honestly don’t get what’s so upsetting about the idea of taking the same sausage - boil it in beer then grill it in Festhaus, properly smoke it at Trappers, and uncase it, pan fry it with Italian seasonings, and put it on pasta at Marco Polo. It would taste so different and unique.

Take the same half chickens and smoke it at trappers, rotisserie it at Festhaus, and pan cook it somewhere else -or- shred it after it’s been rotisseried and use it in a chicken pot pie somewhere.

Make a bunch of brisket at Trappers and use some in a hearty Sheppards Pie.

 

[Unagi]

Make a bunch of brisket at Trappers and use some in a hearty Sheppards Pie.

I think you mean Cottage Pie. Shepherd's Pie is made with lamb, not beef!

 

[warfelg]

I think you mean Cottage Pie. Shepherd's Pie is make with lamb, not beef!

Good catch. Fiancé (strange to type) is Irish so I shouldn’t show her this!!

 

[Jonesta6]

As someone who's made sausage, I'll refute the claim you can use the same sausage between Germany, Italy, and any other country represented without it producing a low-quality product - no amount of post-blend doctoring will fix that, especially if it's already been cased.

However, if they were to invest in a butchery department that can take the same meat they might otherwise cook whole at the varying food venues and also grind it up into a custom sausage blend for each venue serving it, then that'd be awesome assuming they enforce quality control.

They could also take said butchery and possibly lower some food costs if they did the final prep themselves - instead of buying individual pieces of poultry, they could break down the birds into whatever pieces they need - who wouldn't love paying for freshly cooked and carved turkey on their sandwich while also getting smoked legs elsewhere, or the unlimited applications for chicken, etc. Brisket for smoking or corning or stews, whole hog butchery for smoking, sausages, ribs, you name it.

And while you're at it, source from local farms as much as possible to help curry more favor with the local authorities as the park's net economical benefit to the area increases... And provides good PR.

Then you have the same idea for veggies, though tbh I believe they're already set up for that with their commissary kitchen system.

 

[Thriller]

BGW needs to restore food operations from a backup of around 2005 or earlier. Quality, quantity, offerings, and cost all need to be reconsidered. Do away with Food and Wine, Mardi Grasand focus on CT and HOS. The rest of the year focus on just running all its resturaunts the best they can be. They need to go back to their old menus,bring back the Torte Cake, the Mile High corned beef, the smokehouse sampler, open Josephines, Marcos menu back to before it was Marcos, bring back the pizza place in Festa. Affordable prices, consistant operating hours right up to park closing and people will know they can plan on eating in the park once again. Years and years ago we as locals would go to the park just to eat as the highlight of going. I have very fond memories of the chicken place and eating in the small table area overlooking Lemans, or having pizzas and breadsticks overlooking roman rapids and putting way too many quarters in the water squirters. I can remember getting the brisquite from the place that is now trappers snacks and where trappers is was the ticket windows for the Royal Palace. They turned out some amazing BBQ back then. Get the park back to some solid food selections that you can count on and have some snacks that people want. Then have special limited time only food items that people (locals) will go out of their wat to get. This crap of having the same old cupcake with basic flavors they they sell day in and day out and just putting red white and dlie icing and calling it a July 4th special isnt going to cut it.

BGW has several great atmospheric places to sit and eat. The overlooks at Grogans and by Teatro, the seating by the splashdown of Griffon, the back patio of M Sweets, and 2 locations to eat with a show. Dining can be a great experience there, but not currently with the way they are operating.

 

[Rothbury]

My thoughts about the whole food thing is this: BGW is a vacation destination whereas KD is just a destination. Living here in Williamsburg you see families coming here to spend a week on vacation. Sure, they do the history part but they always reserve a day or two to go to BGW and/or WCUSA. You take a family of 4 going to BGW for a day. They will spend in excess of $1000 and probably closer to $2000 just for food, drinks and souvenirs for a day's visit. They might think the food service is terrible and taste terrible, but I've overheard it often enough and seen them just shrug their shoulders and pay whatever the price may be. BGW management doesn't care about us passholders. To BGW management we don't spend the money that full on tourists do. Now, KD has to show quality to attract people to come to just that destination. Sure, they get some tourist traffic but not like BGW.

Do I think BGW will improve the food quality? Honestly? No. Just like most of the rest of you I have seen the quality and quantity go down, too. But as long as BGW can attract the tourist family for the day and spend the money that they do things aren't going to change. I'm ready for the critique now.