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Aug 9, 2017
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For the longest time, I've hated on Verbolten for being a poor replacement for the Big Bad Wolf. I've received many an Eye-Roll for my comments. But now, my ire has shifted to the manufacturers, who won't make a new suspended fully swinging coaster and insist that a rigidly mounted inverted coaster is an acceptable substitute. Even worse, some manufacturers call non-swinging coasters suspended instead of inverted. They are all lowering the bar. Nothing flows like a suspended swinging coaster. A non-swinging inverted coaster will always deliver a lesser experience, unless it does something that would be impossible with swinging, like an inversion, wave turn, or tight clearance near-miss. Why do manufacturers do it? Because it's cheaper and more reliable?

I'm just sad the world will never see the likes of an Eagle Fortress or Big Bad Wolf again.
 
Pretty sure that was due to the one and only Skytrak ride at the Granada Studios Park in Manchester since the design is comparable and Chris Sawyer is from the UK.

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The TL:DR version I’ve heard is that the stresses swinging puts on a track is excessive, would need to be overengineered, to the point where other options are far more cost effective.
This would make sense. That's a lot of torsional stress every time it swings out.
 
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Surely the Vekoma Vampire trains would be lighter than the original Arrow trains? Side note: The Vampire trains look a lot like the Dragonflier trains except they fully swing, right?
 
I've come to accept B&M's non-swinging vehicles for BGW 2025, but the East Coast needs a suspended swinging coaster again. I now want to see Six Cedar Flags Fair work with S&S / Vekoma to make a new suspended coaster, and build it either at KD or SFA (maybe Gadv). For KD, I'd like to see it replace Anaconda, and for SFA, maybe it could replace Penguin's Blizzard River or the closed-off Whistlestop Park area.
 
Vampire's trains do not fully swing and the swing is partially controlled. Vampire's swinging is noticeably weaker than Bat/Vortex/BBW. Those trains are the precursor to the modern Vekoma design.

Suspended coasters are outdated and you probably won't see a proper one built anytime soon. It would be nice for them to make a comeback, but I don't see it happening when you consider the shelf life of the original suspended coasters.

The closest you'll probably get is Flying Turns and that's a heavily outdated model as well.
 
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So I guess zipline coasters will be the closest thing that manufacturers will do new? But I don't count alpine coasters as credits (of which zipline coasters are a subset).
 
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I think they should name this ride "Der Wolf Coaster". It brings back nostalgia for the original, adds a German flair, and also inherently admits this is the generic, off brand replacement for the original. "Der Wolf" rolls off the tongue. Is it a great name? No. Is it perfectly fitting for the coaster? Yessiry Bob.
Expanding my rant here. While B&M is not an off-brand, the B&M family invert sure feels like the off-brand version of the Vekoma SFC. I do not see how B&M's stiff mount design is supposed to deliver a superior ride experience to Vekoma's sway mount design.

Wow-- Vekoma's new sizzle reel is really impressive:

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0:19 - 0:21 shows the sway of the SFC.

Do the STCs have appreciable sway, or are they more like the SLC?
 
Do the STCs have appreciable sway, or are they more like the SLC?
If they do, it’s probably not as noticeable just due to the much more thrilling and extreme motions that model does. Also, here’s a great view of the SFC swaying motion. Did some digging (thanks RCDB!) and found it especially prominent on the sfcs that pull into the station with a nice head of speed. Shown below is Dragonflier.

IMG_9703.png
Shock absorbers/pistons shown above
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Sway shown as train banks into the station^
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Zoomed in view of said sway^
 
I’m reminded of RCT where the “Suspended Single-Rail Coaster” had a lay-down car available.

Also thanks to the mods for making my title a little more professional.
That was really fun to use. I think it was inspired by Skytrak at Granada Studios
 
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I just had another thought. I've found that one of the biggest factors in making a coaster fatiguing to ride is lateral whip. With RMC setting the standard in the industry and Intamin and B&M taking influence from them, whip has never been as fashionable. I get that whip helps makes ejector airtime pop harder, but on an inverted coaster that can't really be an airtime machine, you only get lateral whip. I will only do inverted coasters in the front now.

It's worse than 90s B&M whip because at least you got some cool looking inversions out of it. RMC just has rolls and stalls.

Wooden coasters put the sway into their structure, but suspended swinging coasters turned lateral whip into a flow like no other. The coaster world needs this flow as an antidote to all the whip that has been all the rage since RMC came along.
 
How does [Phoenix Rising] compare to something like Dragonflier at Dollywood?

I know Nicole doesn't have Dragonflier and I have neither credit. That said, I can guarantee you the answer is (likely very) unfavorably.

Per CaptainCoaster, Phoenix Rising has a score of 33.1% and is ranked #1160 in the world vs Dragonflier with a score of 60.4% and a rank of #628.
So even with more track and maneuvers and a custom layout, the B&M Family Inverted coaster delivers a worse experience than a Vekoma Family Suspended with a stock layout. Why did B&M even conceive this dud of a model?

Also, I just noticed the Dragonflier picture was the Coaster Studio guy himself.
 
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Dragonflier/Freedom Flyer are slightly more intense than Phoenix Rising, but both are pretty fun. The Vekoma suspendeds are a bit snappier. The B&Ms flow a bit more.

B&M probably gave Sea World a package deal so BGT ended up with Phoenix Rising. BGT knows B&M usually builds quality products so why not go with the company you've worked with for 30+ years and builds reliable coasters?
 
My issue isn't with PRKS for continuing to do business with a reliable manufacturer. My issue is with B&M for offering a model that delivers an inferior ride experience to the competition. Let me be clear, I do not hate B&M for the family invert. If so, I'd have to write Intamin off for Green Lantern First Flight punching me in the back of the head.

Without swinging, an inverted coaster delivers an experience akin to flying freely (and being whipped about in the plane), a basic and banal sensation if ever there was one, until inversions are involved, at which point loops are massively improved compared to having track below you or having to be on your back at the start.


Without even riding them, I will personally rank the family inverts below even Vortex and Firebird on my master list of B&Ms.
 
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At least for Phoenix Rising, less forceful, less smooth, and far more restrictive/unaccommodating.
I mean - I like the experience of PR over FF. And yes part of my opinion is affected by the fact a minor (age) family member hit his head hard (bruise and swelling) on a transition on FF and enjoyed PR much more. And she’s more the target audience for a ride like this.
 
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