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horsesboy

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Jun 16, 2013
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They confirmed it was an bracket from the ride not a lose article from a guest not that makes any difference to her family.
 
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Brambo

Cyberdyne Systems Software Engineer
Oct 31, 2019
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I think the question that needs to be answered is: Was it maintenance negligence or was it a design flaw?
By no means an expert here but just seems like a design flaw / freak accident. A similar issue happened when Ka initially tested, I believe it was mentioned earlier in this thread or in the TTD thread. I've never been to Cedar Point but it just seems so stupid that the queue was located where it was with little to no protection in between the track and guests. When a train is moving that fast and has that many forces acting on it, engineering simulations just can't account for everything. I hope the victim makes a full recovery, but am really struggling to deal with the fact this could have easily been mitigated.
 
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Nov 30, 2018
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I think the question that needs to be answered is: Was it maintenance negligence or was it a design flaw?
I would put this as likely in the design flaw from not considering the speed that parts could fly off and whether pedestrian areas are safely protected, regardless if proper maintenance was done or not. A good analogy I can use is racetracks where fatal accidents for spectators occurred necessitating higher and stronger fencing to protect the amount of force that launched objects can come with. Having queues exposed to high speed trains is always going to increase risk, so if nets or fences were not considered, that's definitely a design flaw.
 
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Oct 23, 2019
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I haven't been there since 2007. Is the area completely open air at this point?
 

b.mac

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May 14, 2011
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By no means an expert here but just seems like a design flaw / freak accident. A similar issue happened when Ka initially tested, I believe it was mentioned earlier in this thread or in the TTD thread. I've never been to Cedar Point but it just seems so stupid that the queue was located where it was with little to no protection in between the track and guests. When a train is moving that fast and has that many forces acting on it, engineering simulations just can't account for everything. I hope the victim makes a full recovery, but am really struggling to deal with the fact this could have easily been mitigated.

Similar only in that something happened during the ride cycle. Ka's incident happened the ride was launching and TTD's happened while the ride was returning on the brake run.

I haven't been there since 2007. Is the area completely open air at this point?

Area is still basically completely exposed, especially the viewing area right beside the launch.
 
Nov 30, 2018
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The speed of this ride alone should precipitate greater protections all around than a normal coaster. Increases in speed create an exponential increase in kinetic energy generated, so a 120mph ride is going to create 4+ times as much energy from anything flying off as compared to a more common 50-60mph ride.
 
Apr 22, 2019
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Seems like they need to reroute the queue so this can't happen even if, god forbid, a part were to dislodge from a train again. Though I don't know if that's possible. I haven't been to CP in a long time. I don't know what the surrounding area is like. My understanding is that the way Kingda Ka's queue is routed, this could not happen? Is that true?
 

b.mac

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May 14, 2011
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Seems like they need to reroute the queue so this can't happen even if, god forbid, a part were to dislodge from a train again. Though I don't know if that's possible. I haven't been to CP in a long time. I don't know what the surrounding area is like. My understanding is that the way Kingda Ka's queue is routed, this could not happen? Is that true?

Kingda Ka had its queue rerouted through its original overflow pen and runs up alongside the old observation area. Prior to that the Observation area was open access and the queue originally ran 2/3 of the way down the launch and back through the infield of the ride.

Due to the tight space of TTD in the midway it's next to impossible for them to reroute the queue outside of the infield without redesigning the station from scratch and having a huge negative impact on the traffic flow in that area.
 

Jonesta6

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Feb 14, 2019
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If they were to place better fencing next to the track and move the queue closer to the center of the circuit with fewer switchbacks, also extend it to the tophat for the general line and keep fast pass to the left, I think they could be ok.
 
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Jonesta6

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So, based on the description and me not being familiar with flag plates on trains, it sounds like this was a piece to trip prox sensors that somehow came off?

Also, I understand the legal reasons to lock the ride out, but interesting to hear that they literally locked it up - I don't think CP has any interest in running it until it's been cleared, and even then will be rigorously tested
 

ControlsEE

I probably should be working...
Oct 2, 2018
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So from what I'm hearing this report say, it sounds like a piece of angle iron that is used as a flat surface for prox sensors broke off. Given that the bolts were still attached, I'd say that something hit that piece, maybe the sensor itself, and at that speed, it sheered off. They probably put a lock on the main disconnect switch to keep the ride from being powered on after they got the trains put away that day.
 
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horsesboy

DarKoaster stalker
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So, based on the description and me not being familiar with flag plates on trains, it sounds like this was a piece to trip prox sensors that somehow came off?

Also, I understand the legal reasons to lock the ride out, but interesting to hear that they literally locked it up - I don't think CP has any interest in running it until it's been cleared, and even then will be rigorously tested
It might also have to do with preserving the seen. It's not unusual after a significant issue to place seals or locks to insure that no one gets in and manipulates anything or to insure that there is a document chain of custody and control in the event that something that should not have happened caused the accident.
 
Jul 14, 2019
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So, based on the description and me not being familiar with flag plates on trains, it sounds like this was a piece to trip prox sensors that somehow came off?

Also, I understand the legal reasons to lock the ride out, but interesting to hear that they literally locked it up - I don't think CP has any interest in running it until it's been cleared, and even then will be rigorously tested
It sounds like CP has no say in the matter of whether it gets run until its cleared. Video said it was the ODA who put the stop order in place and placed the lock out on the ride.
 

Jonesta6

Glumble
Feb 14, 2019
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It sounds like CP has no say in the matter of whether it gets run until its cleared. Video said it was the ODA who put the stop order in place and placed the lock out on the ride.

That's what I'm referring to - I may not have been clear that I understand it wasn't CP that locked out the ride.
 
May 3, 2011
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No violations were issued to Cedar Point for this incident. No update on if they have cleared TTD to reopen for the 2022 season it seems.
 
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