Nessie's loops

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PageyMoon

PageyMoon

Jul 8, 2010
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New Jersey
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As my mother and I were at the base of Nessie waiting for the fireworks Saturday night, we found ourselves speculating on why two trains never go through her loops at the same time anymore. It's been quite a few years since I've had the pleasure of it happening.

We came up with everything from stress on the structure being too much, some idiot doing something stupid to the other riders, the people who knew how to time it just right not being around anymore, to vaguely thinking there used to be four trains and they all needed to be running to make it work.

Do any of you guys know the actual "why?" I was hoping to take one of the tours and get it answered the next time I go down later this month, but it's making me kind of crazy. Nothing was as awesome as seeing another bunch of people flying through the loops the opposite way a few feet from your head!
 
PageyMoon said:
As my mother and I were at the base of Nessie waiting for the fireworks Saturday night, we found ourselves speculating on why two trains never go through her loops at the same time anymore. It's been quite a few years since I've had the pleasure of it happening.

We came up with everything from stress on the structure being too much, some idiot doing something stupid to the other riders, the people who knew how to time it just right not being around anymore, to vaguely thinking there used to be four trains and they all needed to be running to make it work.

Do any of you guys know the actual "why?" I was hoping to take one of the tours and get it answered the next time I go down later this month, but it's making me kind of crazy. Nothing was as awesome as seeing another bunch of people flying through the loops the opposite way a few feet from your head!
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My family and I took the coaster tour back in June. I never thought to ask about the trains going through the loops at the same time. Got to say the tour is worth every penny spent to take it. Everyone is more than willing to answer questions. I'll be looking to see what you find out after your tour.
 
They have to time the trains departing very specifically to make it happen. I'm guessing that it's too much of a hassle to sync the trains up instead of just loading the trains at a normal pace and dispatching them.
 
I found out that in the old days, the employees had to time it based on the weight of the cars - example- the number of people in the trains. The heavier the train, the faster the speed. Today, with upgraded computer systems, the beautiful double looper is no more. Sadly.

But to be honest, we recall the double looper back in the times of low park attendance and being that we did not have to compare wait times to the fast monstrosities like the Griffon. If we were to sit in the Nessie and wait for the employees to match up the trains... it would seem like eons in comparison to the other coasters in the park.

I suppose it is all about safety and capacity.

However, when you take the coaster tour (an yes- please take the coaster tour!!!! It is super-mega-awesome-o) and you get to stand behind the controls of Nessie.. ask the question and you will have the chance to actually see and clearly understand why.

My brother and I actually got used to the timing as we would sit below the loops and wait.. and we could always tell if the timing was right.. it was a game to us. You always wanted to be the first one to shout DOUBLE-LOOPER before the other. We didn't bet money, but it gave us coaster-cred for the remainder of the day.

 

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When I took the coaster tour last year, one of the two guides said it was because of the stress on the tracks of the the two trains at the same time. Don't know how accurate that is but that was the answer our tour was given.
 
BBW- hmm... my coaster tour was given by the person who actually came up with the concept of the tour and put the tour together. I trust the info I was given. He no longer gives tours (unfortunately). His coaster and BGW knowledge is a thing of legend.

Still, I have never heard anything about the stress of the tracks, but I cannot confirm or deny this information either. Do you remember who your guide was?
 
I don't quite buy that answer either. The structures of the two tracks are completely unrelated. They don't share any common supports.
 
Swiftman said:
I don't quite buy that answer either. The structures of the two tracks are completely unrelated. They don't share any common supports.
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Maybe it's the same tour guide who said BGW was adding Asia.:D
 
^Nora, I do but I really wouldn't want to point any fingers even on a friendly forum such as this one. We were given an awesome tour by two wonderful guides and I can't say enough good things about the backstage tours. Perhaps I misunderstood what was said anyway. I just wanted to mention what I was told for what it was worth, which is why I mentioned the source, but obviously anyone is welcome to delve further and I myself am interested in hearing all possible explanations. I do have a feeling that's the kind of question you'd get as many different answers to as people you asked, though. One of our tour guides did claim a large number of consecutive simultaneous loopers from the days when he was a ride op himself, though.

You mentioned taking the tour to stand by Nessie's controls and actually see and understand why -- what reason were you given? Just the inability of the computer system to take into account the factor you mentioned, the rider weights? And I'd guess differences in loading time, etc. Wonder if any of the ride ops could be persuaded to do some manual dispatches to get the timing right (yeah, right, no way is that gonna happen!)

Regardless of the issues, it would be great to experience a simultaneous loop!
 
I alwasy thought it was just a sequencing thing. I remember them being balls on in the morning and wavering later in the day. I just figured it got harder and harder as the day wore on.
 
BBW- there are these little green sensor boxes all over the track. They tell the computer where every train in is located at any given moment and allows the operator to release the train in the station when the train running has passed a certain mark. The timing of this new system just does not work out for double-loops. :( I know, makes me sad too!

Also, the park is strongly pushing for the highest capacity for each coaster. Technically, if the crews are on their A-game; there should NEVER be a train waiting to pull into the station. One should be leaving right as another one is coming back in. I do know that many times the employees working at each coaster station compete to have bragging rights for the best load times.

If you are in line with me when trains are waiting outside the station or.... if I am on a coaster and am waiting behind one or two trains; you'll hear me say "Tsk tsk.. someone is dropping the ball.."

Oldtimer, if I were to guess at the answer to your statement above, it was probably due to the fact that in the morning there were less people waiting to ride and the employees could relax a bit more and have fun. Later in the afternoon/evening, when park attendance was at its highest, it was get the riders in and out as quickly as possible. Just a guess. Reasoning behind my theory is that I also noticed that near the end of the night the coaster had more double-loopers as well. That would coincide with a dip in the park's visitor numbers.
 
Nora said:
BBW- there are these little green sensor boxes all over the track. They tell the computer where every train in is located at any given moment and allows the operator to release the train in the station when the train running has passed a certain mark. The timing of this new system just does not work out for double-loops. :( I know, makes me sad too!

If you are in line with me when trains are waiting outside the station or.... if I am on a coaster and am waiting behind one or two trains; you'll hear me say "Tsk tsk.. someone is dropping the ball.."
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That, sadly, makes a lot of sense. I'll always hear the guy in the "booth" telling the crew "top of the lift," things like that. Every time I hope it's because they're trying to time the loops, but... oh well.

I'm glad I'm not the only one who critiques the folks running the coasters! I'm usually mumbling about how slow they're going or if they're blabbing instead of checking harnesses, whatever. I just want to ride! haha

My favorite days are when the coaster crews seem to be "racing" each other. When they start getting competitive, that means shorter lines for us! I know one day last season the Griffon crew was yelling to each other about how many riders Apollo had for a certain hour, and they were almost throwing people into seats and getting irritated when people took too long to load. It was pretty funny to see! Those plaques in the stations with what I'm going to assume are record days are pretty impressive. 17,000+ riders? Wow.
 
It was my understanding that both loops were only ever occupied during three-train operation, which just doesn't happen anymore. But the thing about the computer sensors makes sense, too.

I can't STAND stacking trains. I refer to it as a "Six Flags Moment." Stacking is the norm at every Six Flags I've been to, and is becoming more and more common at Kings Dominion (on those occasions where more than one train is being used).
 
Robbie said:
It was my understanding that both loops were only ever occupied during three-train operation, which just doesn't happen anymore. But the thing about the computer sensors makes sense, too.
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There have been three trains going on Nessie every time I've been this year.
 
Nora said:
If you are in line with me when trains are waiting outside the station or.... if I am on a coaster and am waiting behind one or two trains; you'll hear me say "Tsk tsk.. someone is dropping the ball.."
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Usually when that happens, it someone being stupid and not listening or someone too small or too large that makes the sensors trip. Busch has some of the better ride attendants out of all the parks I've ever been to.

And I love it when they smile at me as I hold my thumbs up letting them know I'm ready to go. There aren't enough that ask you if you're ready or how your ride was anymore. I want that back.
 
Apollo always seems to get the cream of the crop as far as ride ops go. The worst of them always seem to end up on Alpen and Nessie. The last few times I've been there the ride ops on Alpen have been terrible. They act totally oblivious of their surroundings.
 
I've never had a problem with any of the ride ops. The longest stacking I've experienced was Alpengeist. I'd say about 45sec-1min.

It is a shame Nesse can't interlock together anymore. On a three train operation, I usually see one train exiting the last loop onto the brake run while another is going down the first drop.
 
In these days of "rush rush rush", nobody is content enough to wait to do cool stuff such as that. I'm sure that if there is a seasoned op running Nessie on a slow day, they might work on getting them into the loop simultaneously, if possible.

I almost have to agree with you, Swiftman. I have noticed the older ops seem to be at Apollo. Of course, that could be because it usually has really long lines and the more experience you have working, the smoother and faster things go.

I think Alpengeist is most likely to have stacking, though I've had it on Apollo, too. People running to put up their stuff and then taking forever to get into the seats. Then you have the big people that have troubles with the harnesses. It happens.
 
Kcracken, I agree with you. I see more delays at Alpen and Griffon due to folks running over and putting their flip flops or other belongings outside the gate; and being super slow about it. I also see many folks struggling to figure out the harnesses at Alpen and Griffon... Seriously? A seat belt folks.. pull the harness over your head and buckle the safety belt... takes a genius. (Gotta love sarcasm)

Another issue that causes delay is the way workers have to stand to check harnesses at the same two coasters. The stand ways away and lean way over to check. Why? Both rides allow the rider to swing their little tootsies back and forth and thus whoever works these rides get bruises on their shins every night from dum-dums who kick their feet out when the poor employees walk by.

Tampa was by far the worst load times I have EVER seen in any park. Get this.. four rides for the front seat ahead of me for Montu and it took 45 minutes to get on. I was livid. 45 minutes for four measly trains to run! The were excruciatingly SLOW! The employees didn't even check the harnesses.. they were busy talking in the booth. The maintenance guys actually came out to check harnesses after the train sat for about 10 minutes on the track with riders wondering what the heck was going on!!!!!! The maintenance guys for Pete's sake! How sad is that! Trust me, there was not a maintenance issue--- the ride ops were just that bad.
 
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