Kings Dominion Project 2024/2025 (?): Jungle X-Pedition Retheme Phase II

[MikeLovesKD]

Considering a Volcano replacement, it would be cool to partner with Intamin. Seems like Intamin has been making their name known again with all these new multi-launch coaster installations. Even BGW used Intamin for both Pantheon and DarKoaster. It seems as if Volcano's spot could fit a decent sized Intamin multi-launch coaster that could perhaps give Pantheon a run for it's money. But will KD do what they've always done and take a more exclusive route?

Thoughts?

 

[CoasterAuditor]

Cedar Fair ostensibly hates intamin so unless something in that relationship changes, very doubtful for the moment that the Volcano replacement is an intamin. Cedar Fair doesn't have the most patience for maintenance issues or costs.

 

[VB06Hokie]

Cedar Fair ostensibly hates intamin so unless something in that relationship changes, very doubtful for the moment that the Volcano replacement is an intamin. Cedar Fair doesn't have the most patience for maintenance issues or costs.

Read this in line for Pantheon as they were announcing technical difficulties. How fitting.

 

[Crunchewy]

Ok, but they put in Twisted Timbers and didn't RMC have a history of issues on some of their rides before then? So it doesn't seem like they are that averse to manufacturers with some technical difficulties.

 

[Beetlegoose]

It seems the tables have turned recently. B&M use to be buddy buddy with BGW and Intamin with Cedar Fair. Maybe it’s time for a switchup. I’d love to see something like a B&M wing coaster to replace Volcano. That’s definitely something that could play well into the Jungle X area with the right themeing and is something BGW just doesn’t have.

 

[Jonesta6]

Ok, but they put in Twisted Timbers and didn't RMC have a history of issues on some of their rides before then? So it doesn't seem like they are that averse to manufacturers with some technical difficulties.

Considering CF bought SV and TT at the same time, and unless I'm mistaken hadn't previously worked with RMC, they didn't have any track record with the chain yet.

Granted, they could look at other parks outside their chain, but it's hard to say what research was done when making that choice.

 

[cschnizer]

It seems the tables have turned recently. B&M use to be buddy buddy with BGW and Intamin with Cedar Fair. Maybe it’s time for a switchup. I’d love to see something like a B&M wing coaster to replace Volcano. That’s definitely something that could play well into the Jungle X area with the right themeing and is something BGW just doesn’t have.

There was a proposal for a B&M wing at one point....which apparently got shelved. For some reason more than half the community is still speculating that model for the replacement.

I'm personally on the infinity coaster band wagon because of their versatility. There's a lot of things you could do with that ride model, and if you put many of those things like a launch, vertical lift, holding drop brake, beyond-vertical drop, and dynamic elements into one layout, I'm sure it would be a great replacement. And for those who veto this over Gerstlauer coasters being rough, I'm sure it would be rough but still very enjoyable. If a B&M wing DOES happen, and it has a layout that everyone likes, then I'll be for it.

 

[CoasterAuditor]

Ok, but they put in Twisted Timbers and didn't RMC have a history of issues on some of their rides before then? So it doesn't seem like they are that averse to manufacturers with some technical difficulties.

Alright a few points to illustrate my thinking:

1. There has not been a new RMC in the Cedar Fair chain since 2018. It is generally believed per discussions I’ve seen over the years Cedar Point is not thrilled with Steel Vengenace from a maintenance cost and reliability standpoint. I’ve never really heard anyone comment on Kings Dominions opinion of maintaining and operating of Twisted Timbers but it is also significantly smaller in scale than SV (with that I’m all for anyone sharing that info) but Cedar Fair is already impacted by SV.

2. Intamin crossed a red line with Cedar Fair with the Shoot the Rapids incident at Cedar Point. After years of issues with Top Thrill Dragster. Since that happened no intamins have been built at a Cedar Fair park.

3. As of right now since Intamin has resurfaced in the US we mostly seem to see their main customers being Comcast and SeaWorld. We haven’t seen Six Flags or Cedar Fair budge on the newer intamins yet. I would assume Six Flags is more likely than CF but until anything changes there I would assume that levee fully intact until/IF any cracks start to show up.

Just my general accumulation of things seen discussed from sources I trust on here and other forums and what I know about the companies involved and their trends as an accountant. Business ties are not repairable so easily because a fixed asset would be REALLY cool I am sad to say.

@VB06Hokie *chefs kiss to illustrate some companies hesitancy with Intamin

 

[MikeLovesKD]

The Volcano theme must return. This is a great opportunity for Cedar Fair to experiment with a well themed attraction for this park. So far it's worked well with BGW when you think of Verbolten and DarKoaster. I always imagined Volcano being pocessed by some entity of the Congo lore. If Cedar Fair had a new mountain built that contained enough indoor space, the park could consider a rather spicy attraction that features a well themed line queue, with a few scary pyrotechnic themed Volcano elements. I'd like to think of something like the new Gotham City Escape ride.

 

[CoasterAuditor]

I’d mark a Mack LSM considerably more likely if we got an attraction similar to GCE ever. Which that should largely fill your desire if they decided to pursue that route. Granted CF has built 0 Macks since Copperhead Strike so that may be one and done for now but I hope not.

Personally I still feel the idea of the Wing happening per my gut and Cedar Fairs love for B&Ms. I hope it’s more like Thunderbird than X-Flight though with a launch.

As of right now the trends and rumors are, we still have no idea. Just based on CFs consistency with buying B&Ms it feels like that’s the most likely manufacturer odds wise, but I will say, I would be happy to be pleasantly surprised.

 

[warfelg]

1. There has not been a new RMC in the Cedar Fair chain since 2018. It is generally believed per discussions I’ve seen over the years Cedar Point is not thrilled with Steel Vengenace from a maintenance cost and reliability standpoint. I’ve never really heard anyone comment on Kings Dominions opinion of maintaining and operating of Twisted Timbers but it is also significantly smaller in scale than SV (with that I’m all for anyone sharing that info) but Cedar Fair is already impacted by SV.

To be fair, I’ve heard some of the dislike goes the other way as well as CF tends to “do their own thing” with maintenance.

 

[MikeLovesKD]

I'm not sure if a B&M Wing coaster would thrill people as much. Seems like more space would be needed in order to create a thrilling design. I hope Cedar Fair isn't planning on removing FoF in order to make room for this new addition. An Intamin multi-launch coaster fits the buck. Gotham City escape only seats 12 people, making the train relatively small. They could fit a lot more ride course elements with a design like that. I'd like the queue area to be some sort of ancient jungle temple.

 

[CoasterAuditor]

To be fair, I’ve heard some of the dislike goes the other way as well as CF tends to “do their own thing” with maintenance.

Ah fun but that’s also not surprising.

 

[cschnizer]

I'm not sure if a B&M Wing coaster would thrill people as much. Seems like more space would be needed in order to create a thrilling design. I hope Cedar Fair isn't planning on removing FoF in order to make room for this new addition. An Intamin multi-launch coaster fits the buck. Gotham City escape only seats 12 people, making the train relatively small. They could fit a lot more ride course elements with a design like that. I'd like the queue area to be some sort of ancient jungle temple.

That's what I'm fearing when people speculate a wing coaster to replace Volcano. A great layout wouldn't be able to fit that space and could be too much for Kings Dominion's finances. I doubt whatever's going there will be above $20 million. So if a wing coaster WERE to happen realistically, it would probably be significantly short and around or under $15 million, maybe a little longer than the plans leaked in 2019.

As awesome as it would be to get anything from Intamin, I'm not sure if Cedar Fair will work with them on this project; ironically enough Volcano was from Intamin. The high maintenance costs and the fiasco with Shoot the Rapids made CF have a bad taste in them, and they're probably hesitant to go to them again even with the newer technologies they've been making. My bets are on Gerstlauer, Mack, S&S, or Vekoma.

 

[MikeLovesKD]

That's what I'm fearing when people speculate a wing coaster to replace Volcano. A great layout wouldn't be able to fit that space and could be too much for Kings Dominion's finances. I doubt whatever's going there will be above $20 million. So if a wing coaster WERE to happen realistically, it would probably be significantly short and around or under $15 million, maybe a little longer than the plans leaked in 2019.

As awesome as it would be to get anything from Intamin, I'm not sure if Cedar Fair will work with them on this project; ironically enough Volcano was from Intamin. The high maintenance costs and the fiasco with Shoot the Rapids made CF have a bad taste in them, and they're probably hesitant to go to them again even with the newer technologies they've been making. My bets are on Gerstlauer, Mack, S&S, or Vekoma.

Hate to say it, but if this attraction does not meet the bang for the buck, I would say that KD just won't be the same. Many theme enthusiast I have spoke to in lines at BGW have said that Volcano made the park what it was. Even when BGW got Verbolten, many people did not care too much because KD was still the closer option for people who lived closer to Washington DC and Richmond. With it being gone, the park just don't have that feel right now. After doing Flight of Fear and I305, it doesn't feel as if there is much to choose from. Or enough to keep you on that side of the park during a busy day.

What I am worried about the most if Cedar Fair's lack of interest for indoor attractions. With BGW only being an hour away and having two indoor rides, I feel KD could eventually be out classed. KD has the space for this type of investment. The resources exist in the theme park industry to make this possible. Should Volcano's replacement be filled as early as 2025? Or could the park consider developing more land on the other side of park where Hurler and Grizzly are? I feel there was a bit more to the Twisted Timbers lore style that could fit that side of the park. What other mysterious forces could exist in the woods of Hanover Hills Orchard?

 

[Jonesta6]

Should Volcano's replacement be filled as early as 2025? Or could the park consider developing more land on the other side of park where Hurler and Grizzly are?

Although I don't know for certain, I believe others here have mentioned both that it's incredibly unlikely for park expansion before infill spots are completed, and surveyors were spotted in Volcano's plot recently.

Hate to say it, but if this attraction does not meet the bang for the buck, I would say that KD just won't be the same. Many theme enthusiast I have spoke to in lines at BGW have said that Volcano made the park what it was. Even when BGW got Verbolten, many people did not care too much because KD was still the closer option for people who lived closer to Washington DC and Richmond.

Just speculative guessing on my part, but I don't think that they necessarily have to build any particular type of ride in that spot because of it's predecessor.

Between the park being viewed as a secondary option to BGW for many (anecdotal for sure, but I feel many people think KD is seedy/dirty/dangerous and thus haven't been since before CF bought it if at all) and all the hints that JX isn't complete, whatever's going in that spot will hopefully be tied well into the area theme and be a good fit for the family audience it appears they're aiming for.

Besides, it's not like there's not a crazy intense giga coaster literally right around the corner...

I feel there was a bit more to the Twisted Timbers lore style that could fit that side of the park. What other mysterious forces could exist in the woods of Hanover Hills Orchard?

While a new attraction going into the old DA plot has been discussed for awhile on another thread, it's unlikely to have anything to do with TT's theming as that's technically an extension of CAG (apple orchard, candy apples...), unless the entrance is on the other side of Juke Box Diner close to where the old Hypersonic XLC station was... Which doesn't make a whole lot of sense.

 

[cschnizer]

With the alleged land surveying, if whatever fills Volcano’s old area is a flat ride package, it could very well be coming next year. Similar to how survey markings were found around Shockwave in 2015 and then Delirium came the next year. This isn’t to say flats are coming, but whatever the park announces by the end of this year what they’ll be doing for 2024 could tell us something about their intentions for the empty plot.

 

[Coasternerd]

Personally I think Virginia needs a modern dark ride, which with the Jungle X lore, could be extraordinary.

 

[VB06Hokie]

I'm not sure if a B&M Wing coaster would thrill people as much. Seems like more space would be needed in order to create a thrilling design. I hope Cedar Fair isn't planning on removing FoF in order to make room for this new addition. An Intamin multi-launch coaster fits the buck. Gotham City escape only seats 12 people, making the train relatively small. They could fit a lot more ride course elements with a design like that. I'd like the queue area to be some sort of ancient jungle temple.

I would hope if they went with a wing that they could cross over FoF's launch tunnel and/or pass behind the show building and utilize the wooded area on the other side near I305. That would make the available area significantly larger.

 

[CoasterMac]

Whatever they do back there, (and I'm sure this is impractical and would look terrible if executed poorly, but) I'd love to see them do something to make the FoF building not so visible. For the sides facing JX, maybe paint trees onto those sides?

or add some rockwork & jungle-y set pieces to the sides? Similar concept to Uncharted at Portaventura: