Attraction Existing Firebird

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I may or may not have had an exchange with a funny lady next to me as we pulled back into the station, in which she said something to the effect of, “that banged your head up, didn’t it?” and I may or may not have acknowledged it. If so, I think it may have ended up on their cutting room floor....
 
b.mac said:
Unforunately the floorless conversions will never have vest restraints, as the changes in seating arrangement require a change in train structure, track structure, and support structure since everything would be considerably wider than the original stand up design. The whole reason why the floorless conversions are possible on these stand-up coasters are because the 1st gen floorless trains have the same track gauge as the stand up trains, along with a similar heart line that would require minimal changes to the ride in order to properly convert.
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Why couldn’t they make cars for it that are 3-across or even 2-across? Whatever is needed to fit the vest restraints. I can’t see Firebird ever being a big draw with the current restraints anyway, so their better capacity is moot.

And actually, not sure it’s true that it can’t be done 4-across. Banshee has vest restraints and look like they are just as close together? Not sure, though. Yes it’s an invert, but those vest restraints look like they’d fit
 
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I may not be a fan of Firebird, but I have to say that my son liked it a lot. We went yesterday. I think having a narrower head must help. :) It was way too hot, though, we didn't last long at the park.
 
Crunchewy said:
And actually, not sure it’s true that it can’t be done 4-across. Banshee has vest restraints and look like they are just as close together? Not sure, though. Yes it’s an invert, but those vest restraints look like they’d fit
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Banshee's second generation trains with the vests are actually wider than B&M's first generation inverted trains. While we have never seen B&M build a brand new floorless coaster with vest restraints, it is safe to assume that they would be wider than the trains they currently offer just based on the changes that were made to other models like this.
 
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Shane said:
Banshee's second generation trains with the vests are actually wider than B&M's first generation inverted trains. While we have never seen B&M build a brand new floorless coaster with vest restraints, it is safe to assume that they would be wider than the trains they currently offer just based on the changes that were made to other models like this.
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I guess then it isn't possible with the old-width 4-across seating. Too bad they won't make a 3-across seating train so they could put in vests. Firebird should be a lot of fun, but for me it isn't, just like the lady in the row behind us on that ride that said at the end, "That shit hurts". Haha.
 
My opinion - somehow the bang/jolt in the corkscrew is worse than I remembered from when it was Apocalypse. I finally put my finger on it. Maybe the ride was just running way faster? I see that unused MCBR. Having that around would greatly help reduce the banging around in the second half and also have the side effect of reducing stacking time.

Other than that, it was pretty good. I'd put it slightly above Scream.
 
SLC Headache said:
My opinion - somehow the bang/jolt in the corkscrew is worse than I remembered from when it was Apocalypse. I finally put my finger on it. Maybe the ride was just running way faster? I see that unused MCBR. Having that around would greatly help reduce the banging around in the second half and also have the side effect of reducing stacking time.

Other than that, it was pretty good. I'd put it slightly above Scream.
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For the record, though myself I find it way too headbangy (and agressively headbangy), my son when he got to ride it liked it a lot. His head is a lot narrower than mine, though. That may help.
 
Crunchewy said:
For the record, though myself I find it way too headbangy (and agressively headbangy), my son when he got to ride it liked it a lot. His head is a lot narrower than mine, though. That may help.
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I've also got a relatively narrow face (maybe why the Mind Eraser VR nearly fell off). The corkscrew was the only notably nasty jolt for me. Probably made worse by being less than fully hydrated (didn't realize only Guest Services had the member cups, then the line at guest services was longer than expected).
 
the MCBR has never been in use on Apocalypse / Iron Wolf. It was originally built on the off chance SFGAm needed a third train but due to how difficult the stand up trains were to check it never needed it.

I do believe you saying it is travelling faster though, for whatever reason the Apocalypse trains took their sweet ass time making their way around the track.
 
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b.mac said:
The locking mechanism for the vest restraints require the metal modesty bars to pivot over the rider's heads. There's no easy way for B&M to provide a vest restraint with the compact seating nature of the original B&M Floorless, Invert, and even the original Dive Machine trains. As much as "they could, but they won't" is an acceptable argument, there's a reason why B&M has opted to change their trains and track to accomodate these new seats instead of the other way around.
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I disagree a little on the how hard it is to do. I think it’s doable. They can scale down certain aspects.

But I also disagree with “they could, but they won’t.”

It’s as simple as this to me:
They could, but financially it’s stupid.

There frankly isn’t enough of these conversions to make the money worth scaling the seats the right way to be worth it. The only reason Vekoma did the arrow train replacement is because there was money to be made, not because they could.
 
warfelg said:
But I also disagree with “they could, but they won’t.”

It’s as simple as this to me:
They could, but financially it’s stupid.
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That's just a more concise version of my statement, though?

Also you don't realize this but the vest restraints have locking mechanisms similar to the seatbelt safety systems in cars, along with 2 hydraulic cylinders to lock the restraints, and a whole slew of electrical wiring to ensure that it's all working. That takes up space, a lot of space. There's a legitimate reason why their Dive Machine and Invert trains are larger with the vests than with the ratchet locking mechanism.

You can see the exact result of that, here:
5Jr5m8P.jpg


They literally have to redesign the trains in order to make it work.
 
I believe that they could make all of that work on a smaller scale if they really wanted to. If there was a huge market to do this conversion they would. There isn't a market to make it worth it. If there was money to be made they would have found a way to do it and make money on it.
 
The regular B&M seat spacing lacks elbow room, so a wider spacing may be part necessary, part overdue. Re: 2-wide, it might have been made better with the original standup train by removing half the seats, less top weight better visibility.
 
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